Dunkirk (Robert Wright & Mickey Kaus)

[Bloggingheads]

[graz]

Onward and upward!

[osmium]

Congrats on your new gig, Bob, I'm really happy about it. I've been sitting here watching BhTV for a long time, and I'm a believer in your idea of covering the ideological spectrum. Looking forward to seeing the future.

[Unit]

I hereby create BloggingHeadsaholic Anonymous.

Hi, my name is Unit....

[badhatharry]

Originally Posted by Unit

I hereby create BloggingHeadsaholic Anonymous.

Hi, my name is Unit....

in unison:

"hi Unit!"

[osmium]

No

[johnatthebar]

Congratulations, Bob. And Brenda, Mickey, Greg, all the other people involved in this that I don't know about.

I found you guys in the fall of '05, at a pretty awful point in my life, and for three or four years I rarely missed an episode. (I still don't think I've ever missed a Bob & Mickey.) It's a wonderful gift you've all been able to give. I don't know of any other website that's been better at showing off the golden age of nonfiction that's flowered before our eyes in the last six years. It's made you guys part of a historic moment I think we'll all remember for the rest of our lives.

If only we had a few more Borgias or Medicis to pay the bills ... but if we did we'd probably all end up in Switzerland.

I'll be grateful if you can find ways to keep this up, and grateful if you can't. Good work.

[badhatharry]

shoulda had a V8!

[Unit]

Suggestions for Bob's show:

Positive Diavlogs

[TwinSwords]

Sorry to hear about the transition at BhTV.

Bob, you have done remarkable work here for five years and have built a legacy you'll always be able to be proud of. You've provided a ton of extremely compelling and high level content that frankly wasn't available anywhere else -- including giving voice to opinions and perspectives that are not often heard in the conventional media.

Thanks for the many, many hours of thought-provoking programming, and best of luck in the new year. Whatever form BhTV takes in the future, I'll continue to be a loyal fan. And honestly, if the new BhTV features more diavlogs with you, it might actually be better!

[Simon Willard]

Best of luck, Bob.

[Globalcop]

Wonderful to see Kaus again. Too bad Wright wasted 1/3 of the show hemming and hawing about his failed project. And even with all that time spent talking about himself and the site, we never even really get any insight as to what the hell went wrong. Five staffers and they still can't explain to diavloggers how to do a mic check? How to maintain a quiet area for recording? They still record diavlogs without a way to monitor the audio? Forget about the content for a minute, the site will never succeed with such horrible basic technical quality.

Why is it even a video site? These could easily be audio podcasts. Bob has NEVER taken advantage of the video except to hold up a book cover now and then. Never used overlays, never shown graphs, etc. Completely misused medium. Good luck even trying to find the audio-only RSS anymore, they've hidden it on purpose.

And what does Bob mean when he says that the "Classic" BHTV is made up of first-timers who don't know how to use a computer? It sounds to me like they're planning to dump the regulars: Althouse; Lowry; McWhorter; etc. They all have webcams, mics, etc all setup and know how to use them.

I don't know where Bob is getting his figures (7 out of 9) but if you just go back and look at the past few months of Diavlogs, the overwhelming majority are "regulars" with working mics and webcams and experience with BHTV.

There is something very odd here and I don't think Wright is giving us the straight dope. Looks more like he is actually turning this into the Bob network.

What a sad thing. Yeah, just what will draw the viewers, more of Bob's dynamic stammering. I don't know about the rest of you, but Bob Wright is not the reason I've been coming to BHTV for all these years.

[Hume's Bastard]

If I recall a previous explanation, the technical problems had to do with post-production issues and asking people to do diavlogs. I can understand that professionals from various parts of the world with varying schedules would be enough to give any staff a trial. Factoring in whatever personal baggage each 'head brings, professional conflicts with 'heads from other organizations, and restrictions set by employers, all those other 'heads we love come at a premium.

As for the video suggestions, I agree. But, that would add to post-production. Five people, that's it!

[Wonderment]

There is something very odd here and I don't think Wright is giving us the straight dope.

Awesome rant, Globo! You're the first Bloggingheads Truther.

[bjkeefe]

Originally Posted by Wonderment

Awesome rant, Globo! You're the first Bloggingheads Truther.

If there was ever a final one to end on, let it be that one. Well done, Wondermentperson.

Speaking of which (in re the first 20 min), I thought Mickey was perfect. Say what you will about him, and I've said plenty, he does have that LA state of mind that's just the right blend of tough and tender, that can at the same time appreciate what has happened and keep in it perspective.

Of course I will wish Bob the best of luck in his future endeavors, recent unpleasantnesses notwithstanding. I suppose I will let the news settle and digest for a bit before I say anything more on this front.

To the rest of you, diavloggers and commenters (well, in all honesty, to a strong fraction of the rest of you): thank you for every which way you've stretched my mind, challenged my preconceptions, made me laugh, and fired up my cylinders. I've made a few friends here that I hope will last for life, I'm sure I'm not alone in that, and when it comes right down to it, I think Mr. Wright ought to take that one to the bank.

Go12.

Over and out.

[Hume's Bastard]

Originally Posted by bjkeefe

To the rest of you, diavloggers and commenters (well, in all honesty, to a strong fraction of the rest of you): thank you for every which way you've stretched my mind, challenged my preconceptions, made me laugh, and fired up my cylinders. I've made a few friends here that I hope will last for life, I'm sure I'm not alone in that, and when it comes right down to it, I think Mr. Wright ought to take that one to the bank.

Go12.

Over and out.

And, thank you.

I wish now I could have posted more.

[TwinSwords]

Originally Posted by bjkeefe

Well done, Wondermentperson.

Speaking of which (in re the first 20 min), I thought Mickey was perfect. Say what you will about him, and I've said plenty, he does have that LA state of mind that's just the right blend of tough and tender, that can at the same time appreciate what has happened and keep in it perspective.

Of course I will wish Bob the best of luck in his future endeavors, recent unpleasantnesses notwithstanding. I suppose I will let the news settle and digest for a bit before I say anything more on this front.

To the rest of you, diavloggers and commenters (well, in all honesty, to a strong fraction of the rest of you): thank you for every which way you've stretched my mind, challenged my preconceptions, made me laugh, and fired up my cylinders. I've made a few friends here that I hope will last for life, I'm sure I'm not alone in that, and when it comes right down to it, I think Mr. Wright ought to take that one to the bank.

Go12.

Over and out.

Nice post; well said.

(np;ws?)

[rfrobison]

Originally Posted by bjkeefe

To the rest of you, diavloggers and commenters (well, in all honesty, to a strong fraction of the rest of you): thank you for every which way you've stretched my mind, challenged my preconceptions, made me laugh, and fired up my cylinders. I've made a few friends here that I hope will last for life, I'm sure I'm not alone in that, and when it comes right down to it, I think Mr. Wright ought to take that one to the bank.

Go12.

Over and out.

Well, Mr. Keefe, you've been a friend -- to the extent that one can apply that term to people one never actually meets. I will be sad indeed if there ends up being no cyberplace (ooh, how retro: "cyber"!) where people of goodwill with different perspectives can get together and test each others' thinking for soundness and truth.

To the entire Bhtv community, I would like to say: Best of luck. Keep thinking and keep caring. You are a credit to politics, each and every one.

I'll be watching.

[Globalcop]

Originally Posted by Wonderment

Awesome rant, Globo! You're the first Bloggingheads Truther.

Thanks, but it's a stretch to compare the transition of BHTV from a diverse forum to the Bob Wright show and the transition of two packed commercial airliners into missiles that killed 3000 people.

Saying that Bob is being disingenuous about the reasons he gives (his equivocation and stammering explanation certainly don't dampen my skepticism) is a far cry from blaming President Bush of taking down WTC in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Congrats for the juvenile reply; as usual, the peanut gallery is there to encourage the shameless trolling. Still waiting for a substantive reply.

[TwinSwords]

Originally Posted by Globalcop

Thanks, but it's a stretch to compare the transition of BHTV from a diverse forum to the Bob Wright show and the transition of two packed commercial airliners into missiles that killed 3000 people.

Saying that Bob is being disingenuous about the reasons he gives (his equivocation and stammering explanation certainly don't dampen my skepticism) is a far cry from blaming President Bush of taking down WTC in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Congrats for the juvenile reply; as usual, the peanut gallery is there to encourage the shameless trolling. Still waiting for a substantive reply.

A substantive reply? Okay.

How much do you suppose it costs to run BhTV? To pay for the web hosting, support the personnel necessary to maintain the technical infrastructure, to edit the videos, and to do the copy editing necessary to create diavlog topics, topic titles, to book guests, to distribute equipment to diavloggers, to manage the forum, and whatever else is needed to keep the operation running as smoothly as it has for all these years?

And whatever figure you come up with -- however many hundreds of thousands of dollars per year you figure (because it's certainly no less than that) -- where did you think that money was coming from all this time? And where do you propose Bob get that money in 2012?

And while you're thinking of the answers to those questions, here's another: Why would Bob bust his ass for five years building what is possibly his proudest professional accomplishment only to sabotage it in 2012?

Bob Wright: If you are reading this, you should know that on a per post basis, there has never been a more hostile and belligerent person in this forum than "Globocop." He can't match Whatfur, kidneystones, or Lyle for volume of posts, but his per post rate of vitriol and hysteria surpasses even those now thankfully banned wingnuts.

[Globalcop]

Originally Posted by TwinSwords

A substantive reply? Okay.

How much do you suppose it costs to run BhTV? To pay for the web hosting, support the personnel necessary to maintain the technical infrastructure, to edit the videos, and to do the copy editing necessary to create diavlog topics, topic titles, to book guests, to distribute equipment to diavloggers, to manage the forum, and whatever else is needed to keep the operation running as smoothly as it has for all these years?

And whatever figure you come up with -- however many hundreds of thousands of dollars per year you figure (because it's certainly no less than that) -- where did you think that money was coming from all this time? And where do you propose Bob get that money in 2012?

And while you're thinking of the answers to those questions, here's another: Why would Bob bust his ass for five years building what is possibly his proudest professional accomplishment only to sabotage it in 2012?

Bob Wright: If you are reading this, you should know that on a per post basis, there has never been a more hostile and belligerent person in this forum than "Globocop." He can't match Whatfur, kidneystones, or Lyle for volume of posts, but his per post rate of vitriol and hysteria surpasses even those now thankfully banned wingnuts.

All I'm saying is, his explanation doesn't make sense.

Vitriol and hysteria? Is that the same as not kissing Bob's ass and making excuses for the terrible technical problems?

Is there any other podcast that anyone here listens to/watches that comes even close to the audio problems that BHTV has?

Why hasn't Bob simply gotten a single sponsor, like Audible? He sure ain't concerned with conflict of interest or undue influence of content (Ford Foundation?).

Bob says there is no business model that works. Huh? Leo LaPorte is making over $1 million a year with TWiT. Maybe because he started off using normal tech like Skype and you can actually hear what people are saying (and at least if there is an audio problem, everyone knows it right away and they don't waste an hour recording useless audio).

Why is everyone so freaked out about someone pointing out that there has been a serious flaw with Bob's proprietary method since day one? Why has he never tried a different method of recording, when there are so many other options? Anyone could record a simple BHTV diavlog using Google+ Hangouts in about 15 minutes.

I'm sorry, but Bob's insistence to do this thing in the most arcane and complicated manner is the reason why it has failed, and he just can't admit it. It fits perfectly with his personality to have a group such as you all to pat him on the back and assure him that he's a hero on the 'net and any critic, if not banned already, is only a few posts away from being censored.

It is hilarious that you're actually speaking to Bob directly. Way to prove my point sycophant.

[miceelf]

Originally Posted by Globalcop

Is there any other podcast that anyone here listens to/watches that comes even close to the audio problems that BHTV has?

There is no other podcast I listen to/watch, period. Full stop.

[sapeye]

Originally Posted by Globalcop

Five staffers and they still can't explain to diavloggers how to do a mic check?

This is a seriously unfair criticism. We all have different relationships to technology and many of the participants may not be comfortable adjusting the equipment, no matter how many times the staffers explain how to do it. Glenn Loury, for example, has the very distracting habit of jiggling his camera. Since I like him a lot and since I find his diavlogs almost unwatchable when he's bouncing around the screen, I've written to him on three separate occasions to ask him to please try to avoid camera movement. Each time he's promptly and courteously replied to apologize and promise to do better. And he does... for a while until he forgets again.

As far as I know, the participants aren't paid and some of them tape at work, or have kids, and may not have ready access to a perfectly quiet space.

Plus, of course there are the inherent vagaries of technology. Ever had problems with Skype or other communication links? How many techs do they have maintaining their systems. Considering that BH is a very low budget operation, and also considering how much it costs us to watch, it seems to me they do a great job.

[badhatharry]

Originally Posted by sapeye

This is a seriously unfair criticism.

hear! hear! I just don't get how someone feels justified in crticizing the product when the product is free and no one is being compelled to participate. So there!

[miceelf]

Originally Posted by badhatharry

hear! hear! I just don't get how someone feels justified in crticizing the product when the product is free and no one is being compelled to participate. So there!

"Waiter, the soup tasted terrible. And there wasn't enough of it."

[AemJeff]

Originally Posted by sapeye

This is a seriously unfair criticism. We all have different relationships to technology and many of the participants may not be comfortable adjusting the equipment, no matter how many times the staffers explain how to do it. Glenn Loury, for example, has the very distracting habit of jiggling his camera. Since I like him a lot and since I find his diavlogs almost unwatchable when he's bouncing around the screen, I've written to him on three separate occasions to ask him to please try to avoid camera movement. Each time he's promptly and courteously replied to apologize and promise to do better. And he does... for a while until he forgets again.

As far as I know, the participants aren't paid and some of them tape at work, or have kids, and may not have ready access to a perfectly quiet space.

Plus, of course there are the inherent vagaries of technology. Ever had problems with Skype or other communication links? How many techs do they have maintaining their systems. Considering that BH is a very low budget operation, and also considering how much it costs us to watch, it seems to me they do a great job.

Yeah, it was a pretty dumb criticism that completely ignored the nature of what was being criticized. I know plenty about computers and I'm comfortable around recording equipment, and there were technical issues with both of my diavlogs, some of them completely my fault. People are generally not physically present, do these things only occasionally, are unpaid, and often inexpert; nevertheless, we've seen nearly two thousand successfully completed diavlogs.

[Globalcop]

Originally Posted by AemJeff

Yeah, it was a pretty dumb criticism that completely ignored the nature of what was being criticized. I know plenty about computers and I'm comfortable around recording equipment, and there were technical issues with both of my diavlogs, some of them completely my fault. People are generally not physically present, do these things only occasionally, are unpaid, and often inexpert; nevertheless, we've seen nearly two thousand successfully completed diavlogs.

All of these excuses point to the main problem with the BHTV set up: the participants are not listening to the audio that we will hear, they are listening to the phone. Those of you who are making excuses for BHTV and who claim to have some technical skills understand that it is a fundamental flaw to put so much time and effort into a recording that no one is monitoring.

Even on Skype, at least the person on the other end can say, "Hey, I can't hear you."

No wonder this thing has been running down the wrong track for so long, everyone just loves to kiss ass. When someone tries to point out a problem, you all just us it as an opportunity to show the world how much of a true fan you are, by trashing the messenger. The fact remains: this experiment has failed.

And anyone who says the show is immune from criticism because it is free is a damn fool. Why even bother to waste time posting such sycophantic drivel? Hoping Bob might read your post and award you with a signed book?

[TwinSwords]

Originally Posted by Globalcop

All of these excuses point to the main problem with the BHTV set up: the participants are not listening to the audio that we will hear, they are listening to the phone.

And yet, BhTV has been enormously successful at generating more than a diavlog a day for a number of years. The truth is that the "real problem" you've identified hasn't been very much of a problem at all. The instances when diavlogs were cut short or had audio modulation problems have been few and far between. There's certainly no evidence that these problems are the cause of the coming changes to BhTV.

The truth, Globocop, is that your complaints are more about your own sociopathy and less about BhTV. You're the kind of aggressive, authoritarian bully who sees someone down and immediately starts fantasizing about getting your boot on their neck, and stomping. You live for this sort of thing; it's what makes you feel good. You're hateful, and you're mean. And you know it.

Originally Posted by Globalcop

Those of you who are making excuses for BHTV and who claim to have some technical skills understand that it is a fundamental flaw to put so much time and effort into a recording that no one is monitoring.

Then how do you explain the consistency of the diavlogs, Bob's ability to reliably post more than one new diavlog a day over a period of years? The "fundamental flaw" never amounted to more than an occasional problem.

Originally Posted by Globalcop

No wonder this thing has been running down the wrong track for so long, everyone just loves to kiss ass. When someone tries to point out a problem, you all just us it as an opportunity to show the world how much of a true fan you are, by trashing the messenger. The fact remains: this experiment has failed.

Hey, wait a minute; you're changing your story. At first it was a conspiracy where Bob was gutting BhTV to bring more glory to himself. Now, without any evidence at all, you're asserting that the changes are due to the "failure" of an experiment.

I'd like to see you try to substantiate that claim with anything resembling compelling evidence -- or even compelling argumentation. We both know you can't.

Originally Posted by Globalcop

And anyone who says the show is immune from criticism because it is free is a damn fool. Why even bother to waste time posting such sycophantic drivel? Hoping Bob might read your post and award you with a signed book?

The truth is far more nuanced than you can grasp. The truth is that people can simultaneously be supportive of an enterprise and offer constructive criticism in an effort to be helpful. You don't seem to realize that.

[AemJeff]

Originally Posted by Globalcop

All of these excuses point to the main problem with the BHTV set up: the participants are not listening to the audio that we will hear, they are listening to the phone. Those of you who are making excuses for BHTV and who claim to have some technical skills understand that it is a fundamental flaw to put so much time and effort into a recording that no one is monitoring.

Even on Skype, at least the person on the other end can say, "Hey, I can't hear you."

No wonder this thing has been running down the wrong track for so long, everyone just loves to kiss ass. When someone tries to point out a problem, you all just us it as an opportunity to show the world how much of a true fan you are, by trashing the messenger. The fact remains: this experiment has failed.

And anyone who says the show is immune from criticism because it is free is a damn fool. Why even bother to waste time posting such sycophantic drivel? Hoping Bob might read your post and award you with a signed book?

You started out saying something cogent, if not completely aligned with reality. Some of the problems with BhTV's presentation are certainly due to the fact that participants often aren't listening to the signal that is being recorded. You win some, you lose some. Since the premise here is cheap tech and getting by, and since that means that the participants' voices are being recorded locally, then having them focus on the telephone conversation, rather than the recorded signal, is an important factor in service of the goal of creating a conversation worth recording.

After a promising start the post just seemed to devolve into vitriol, unfortunately. Nice try, though.

[bkjazfan]

Being a political junkie I have enjoyed my 4 1/2 years viewing BHTV. It's been my go to place to check out on the Net practically everyday. The intellectual stimulation and happiness it has brought to my life is immeasureable.

Thanks to Bob and crew,

John

[bkjazfan]

Kudos to Mickey for mentioning political journalist Thomas Edsall. His '92 book "Chain Reaction: The Impact of Race, Rights, and Taxes on American Politics" was one of the finest non fiction books I have ever read.

[ledocs]

My mean reason for being at the bhtv site is to read your posts, Globalcop.

[sapeye]

Ah, Bob, when the larger world beckons, one must answer the call. Of course a regular salary is probably somewhat alluring, too. Carry on, nurse...

Thank you for all your efforts and successes in creating and maintaining BH. I've enjoyed and grumbled during many happy hours viewing and reading. And thanks, too, for keeping it going as much as possible, even if in a different form. I think Mickey (yes, great to have him back) is on to something with his idea of naked mud wrestling.

One request that I imagine many of others will echo: Try to preserve Science Saturday! Thank you. Bob

[Hume's Bastard]

Originally Posted by sapeye

Try to preserve Science Saturday! Thank you. Bob

A hearty second!

[Sulla the Dictator]

Good luck Bob. It was a great ride. I've been watching for about 5 years, and enjoyed or was enraged by a great deal. That's what good television is supposed to do.

[Hume's Bastard]

This is the second-best video capture I can recall recently (the best being Henry Farrell's abject visage when Varoufakis described the Greek situation). I really missed Mickey Kaus and these Wright-Kaus diavlogs. I hope Wright and Kaus keep this feature, or at least battle in text. Mickey Kaus personified the ethos of this site - no one more demonstrated why bhtv needed two windows to work. He always challenged with his opinions and he always did it with a big heart.

That said, I will treasure bhtv, mark 2 all the more. Maybe I didn't link enough here or from my blog or on other social media. I tried to do as as much as I could. I would talk about this website as much as I could offline.

But, Bob, you started diavlogging with people around the world and made it as far as India. China, if you count certain topics. You have to circumnavigate the globe!

Thank you, Bob and Mickey for years of entertainment, elucidation, and class!

[Monkey Corp]

Good luck Bob. What you've done here has been wonderful. Thank you.

[JonIrenicus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIGxezrlj2I


Though this may not be an end so much as a transformation. Hopefully things go smoothly enough for people to stay employed though, but if not, there is always something new.

[thouartgob]

Originally Posted by JonIrenicus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIGxezrlj2I


Though this may not be an end so much as a transformation. Hopefully things go smoothly enough for people to stay employed though, but if not, there is always something new.

Nice link. I also like the Q "It's a Wonderful Life" episode. I wonder if we can also learn something about what really important if we experience a life without bloggingheads

[badhatharry]

Originally Posted by thouartgob

Nice link. I also like the Q "It's a Wonderful Life" episode. I wonder if we can also learn something about what really important if we experience a life without bloggingheads

That may be going a bit too far!
Truth be told, part of me is glad that my obsession will be forcibly curbed (although it really isn't clear what's going to be happeneing). This way I'll be able to keep a better eye on the climate change controversy or maybe even talk to my husband!