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  #1  
Old 06-09-2011, 05:40 PM
Bloggingheads Bloggingheads is offline
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Default The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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  #2  
Old 06-09-2011, 08:08 PM
Mari Dupont Mari Dupont is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

Jesus Christ, is Bill Scher such an authority worshiper that he couldnt cough up even the slightest bit of outrage over the SWAT team story? His response was beyond pathetic.
/rant
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  #3  
Old 06-09-2011, 08:43 PM
ohreally ohreally is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

Except for libertarian whack jobs, all good Americans worship armed authority. Cops and soldiers are our true heroes, dontcha know? Bagram, Gitmo, wiretapping, yeah, yeah, we don't like 'em much BUT they keep us safe, so we don't have to hide under our beds all day long.

When Bush was almost hit by a shoe, card-carrying liberal Rick Perlstein prayed that the shoe thrower would "go to jail for a rather long time." That's your American liberal: you don't show proper deference to authority, there's Rikers Island for you! And, sure enough, Clinton increased the prison population more than all post-WWII Republican presidents combined.
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  #4  
Old 06-09-2011, 10:25 PM
Diane1976 Diane1976 is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by ohreally View Post
Except for libertarian whack jobs, all good Americans worship armed authority. Cops and soldiers are our true heroes, dontcha know? Bagram, Gitmo, wiretapping, yeah, yeah, we don't like 'em much BUT they keep us safe, so we don't have to hide under our beds all day long.

When Bush was almost hit by a shoe, card-carrying liberal Rick Perlstein prayed that the shoe thrower would "go to jail for a rather long time." That's your American liberal: you don't show proper deference to authority, there's Rikers Island for you! And, sure enough, Clinton increased the prison population more than all post-WWII Republican presidents combined.
I get the sense you're vaguely onto something. I recall reading about how a real left might be impossible in the US because of its, er imperialistic, role in the world (having more or less picked up where Britain left off). Any such movement would be squashed. It seems like a bit of a conspiracy theory, but it could be true. I always remember the cartoon on the contented cow conspiracy theory about the beef industry.
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  #5  
Old 06-10-2011, 10:23 AM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by Diane1976 View Post
I get the sense you're vaguely onto something. I recall reading about how a real left might be impossible in the US because of its, er imperialistic, role in the world (having more or less picked up where Britain left off). Any such movement would be squashed. It seems like a bit of a conspiracy theory, but it could be true. I always remember the cartoon on the contented cow conspiracy theory about the beef industry.
I guess that depends on what you want to call a 'real' left (no true Scotsman). Leftist governments tend to quite like imperialism and hegemony--see Hugo Chavez's attempts at influencing the elections of surrounding countries.

I think the reason why a harder left movement can't have success right now is that we still have an individualistic and anti-authority spirit. Yes, we often make cops our heroes. But check out the movies--quite often it's the lone cop, going out on his own and beyond his orders--the authority gets in his way.

Now, compare that with the Euro welfare states that arrest people for saying things that they don't like, ban movies that they don't like, etc. You can not have leftist rule without a population that will submit itself to a tutelary authority.
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  #6  
Old 06-10-2011, 10:51 AM
miceelf miceelf is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by operative View Post
(no true Scotsman).
!!!!



Quote:
Originally Posted by operative View Post
Leftist governments tend to quite like imperialism and hegemony--see Hugo Chavez's attempts at influencing the elections of surrounding countries.
Ah, yes. Those imperialist Swedes.
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  #7  
Old 06-12-2011, 06:05 AM
Baz Baz is offline
 
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Default Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by operative View Post
Leftist governments tend to quite like imperialism and hegemony--see Hugo Chavez's attempts at influencing the elections of surrounding countries.
What's Hugo up to now...he's not giving cheap oil to poor Americans again is he, evil bastard.



Broaden you're horizons man or it'll always be garbage in and garbage out.
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  #8  
Old 06-12-2011, 09:08 AM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by Baz View Post
What's Hugo up to now...he's not giving cheap oil to poor Americans again is he, evil bastard.



Broaden you're horizons man or it'll always be garbage in and garbage out.
Oh dear, a Chavez fanboy.
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  #9  
Old 06-12-2011, 10:11 PM
Baz Baz is offline
 
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Default Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by operative View Post
Oh dear, a Chavez fanboy.
That's all you got...childish nonsense? You didn't answer the question, what's he up to now man?

As long as Chavez isn't influencing other countries elections the "American Way" he's immediately a step up from terrorist states like the US in my book, which isn't saying much.
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  #10  
Old 06-12-2011, 10:40 PM
sugarkang sugarkang is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by Baz View Post
As long as Chavez isn't influencing other countries elections the "American Way" he's immediately a step up from terrorist states like the US in my book, which isn't saying much.
I think it's clear that Chavez cares about the plight of the poor. The question is whether it's worth it at the expense of 80% of the rest of society. The data seem to show that:

1. Real GDP tracks alongside the non-oil sector.
2. Venezuela's overall economy has been in steady decline ever since Chavez took power.
3. Higher oil prices alone cannot make up for losses in private investment.

As someone who really admired Noam Chomsky (and still do for some things), I thought that Chavez would be the modern world's last chance to make a go of socialism. The conclusion is that it doesn't work.

And for those of you that hate greedy corporations, I'd suggest you take an interest in studying that which you hate. You may find that your emotions have been misplaced.



http://www.cepr.net/documents/public...la-2009-02.pdf
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  #11  
Old 06-12-2011, 11:38 PM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by sugarkang View Post
I think it's clear that Chavez cares about the plight of the poor. The question is whether it's worth it at the expense of 80% of the rest of society. The data seem to show that:

1. Real GDP tracks alongside the non-oil sector.
2. Venezuela's overall economy has been in steady decline ever since Chavez took power.
3. Higher oil prices alone cannot make up for losses in private investment.

As someone who really admired Noam Chomsky (and still do for some things), I thought that Chavez would be the modern world's last chance to make a go of socialism. The conclusion is that it doesn't work.

And for those of you that hate greedy corporations, I'd suggest you take an interest in studying that which you hate. You may find that your emotions have been misplaced.



http://www.cepr.net/documents/public...la-2009-02.pdf
Indeed, and that's not even getting into Chavez's human rights abuses, the erosion of democratic institutions, the skyrocketing crime rate, the support of drug gangs and meddling in neighboring countries, the rank antisemitism, etc.
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  #12  
Old 06-13-2011, 01:52 AM
Baz Baz is offline
 
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Default Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by operative View Post
Indeed, and that's not even getting into Chavez's human rights abuses, the erosion of democratic institutions, the skyrocketing crime rate, the support of drug gangs and meddling in neighboring countries, the rank antisemitism, etc.
Blah blah blah...you have nothing but right wing talking points.

Edit: Operative unless you provide facts about reality and stop what is best described as copying and pasting garbage straight from a Fox Nation blog post, you sound just like the mainstream liberal hacks you attack constantly.

Last edited by Baz; 06-13-2011 at 03:13 AM..
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  #13  
Old 06-13-2011, 03:24 AM
sugarkang sugarkang is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by Baz View Post
Blah blah blah...you have nothing but right wing talking points.

Edit: Operative unless you provide facts about reality and stop what is best described as copying and pasting garbage straight from a Fox Nation blog post, you sound just like the mainstream liberal hacks you attack constantly.
You're not referring to my post as a Fox Nation blog post are you? Because I linked the original reference which originates from the Center for Economic and Policy Research, a progressive think tank according Wikipedia.
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  #14  
Old 06-13-2011, 06:25 AM
Baz Baz is offline
 
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Default Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

Operative being the poor soul that he is made a silly comment criticizing Hugo Chavez for trying to influence a neighbors elections. Then in a real twist of irony you post a graph which shows in 2002 the results of a US backed coup against a democratically elected government in a neighboring country.

So lets deal with "Socialism not working" then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarkang View Post
I think it's clear that Chavez cares about the plight of the poor. The question is whether it's worth it at the expense of 80% of the rest of society. The data seem to show that:

1. Real GDP tracks alongside the non-oil sector.
2. Venezuela's overall economy has been in steady decline ever since Chavez took power.
3. Higher oil prices alone cannot make up for losses in private investment.

As someone who really admired Noam Chomsky (and still do for some things), I thought that Chavez would be the modern world's last chance to make a go of socialism. The conclusion is that it doesn't work.

And for those of you that hate greedy corporations, I'd suggest you take an interest in studying that which you hate. You may find that your emotions have been misplaced.



http://www.cepr.net/documents/public...la-2009-02.pdf
I apologize in advance if I sound rude or offensive. But WTF is this garbage supposed to mean?? I read and then re-read the publication you linked to and I can only come to the conclusion that either you didn't read it, you can't read, or you're a fellow in the Cato Institute. Tell me whats happened to 80% of the people in Venezuela? You're talking nonsense. Read the whole paper, its only 24 pages.

This is the summary of the paper you linked to.

Quote:
Executive Summary

This paper looks at some of the most important economic and social indicators during the 10 years of the Chávez administration in Venezuela, as well as the current economic expansion. It also looks at the current situation and challenges.

Among the highlights:

The current economic expansion began when the government got control over the national oil company in the first quarter of 2003. Since then, real (inflation-adjusted) GDP has nearly doubled, growing by 94.7 percent in 5.25 years, or 13.5 percent annually.

Most of this growth has been in the non-oil sector of the economy, and the private sector has grown faster than the public sector.

During the current economic expansion, the poverty rate has been cut by more than half, from 54 percent of households in the first half of 2003 to 26 percent at the end of 2008. Extreme poverty has fallen even more, by 72 percent. These poverty rates measure only cash income, and do not take into account increased access to health care or education.

Over the entire decade, the percentage of households in poverty has been reduced by 39 percent, and extreme poverty by more than half.

Inequality, as measured by the Gini index, has also fallen substantially. The index has fallen to 41 in 2008, from 48.1 in 2003 and 47 in 1999. This represents a large reduction in inequality.

Real (inflation-adjusted) social spending per person more than tripled from 1998-2006.

From 1998-2006, infant mortality has fallen by more than one-third. The number of primary care physicians in the public sector increased 12-fold from 1999-2007, providing health care to millions of Venezuelans who previously did not have access.

There have been substantial gains in education, especially higher education, where gross enrollment rates more than doubled from 1999-2000 to 2007-2008.

The labor market also improved substantially over the last decade, with unemployment dropping from 11.3 percent to 7.8 percent. During the current expansion it has fallen by more than half. Other labor market indicators also show substantial gains.

Over the past decade, the number of social security beneficiaries has more than doubled.

Over the decade, the government’s total public debt has fallen from 30.7 to 14.3 percent of GDP. The foreign public debt has fallen even more, from 25.6 to 9.8 percent of GDP.

Inflation is about where it was 10 years ago, ending the year at 31.4 percent. However it has been falling over the last half year (as measured by three-month averages) and is likely to continue declining this year in the face of strong deflationary pressures worldwide.

Here's another interesting quote from the paper:

Quote:
There has also been a sharp drop in inequality, as measured by the Gini index. Since Chávez’s election, the Gini index has dropped by almost six points, from 46.96 to 40.99. In this most recent expansion, the drop has been even greater: over seven points, from 48.11 to 40.99. For a rough idea of the size of such a change in the distribution of income, compare this to a similar movement in the other direction: from 1980-2005, the Gini index for the United States went from 40.3 to 46.92, a period in which there was a large (upward) redistribution of income.
A real disaster story eh. Go and research the reality about Venezuela and other parts of South America and you might learn something.
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:55 AM
Ocean Ocean is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by sugarkang View Post
I think it's clear that Chavez cares about the plight of the poor. The question is whether it's worth it at the expense of 80% of the rest of society. The data seem to show that:

1. Real GDP tracks alongside the non-oil sector.
2. Venezuela's overall economy has been in steady decline ever since Chavez took power.
3. Higher oil prices alone cannot make up for losses in private investment.
I'm not sure how to interpret the graph you showed to support your points above (?), but I looked at the document you linked to and I was impressed with a number of facts of which I wasn't aware.

Here are some samples:

Quote:
Poverty and Inequality
As can be seen in Table 3, there has been a huge decline in poverty and extreme poverty during the current economic expansion. The percentage of households in poverty declined by more than half, from 54 percent in the first half of 2003, to an estimated 26 percent at the end of 2008. The percentage of households in extreme poverty fell by even more: a 72 percent decline, to seven percent of total households. This is a significant achievement, and puts Venezuela within reach of eliminating extreme poverty altogether. It is worth noting that the United Nations’ Millennium Development Goals call for a reduction in extreme poverty by half over the period 1990-2015.
If we take the first half of 1999 as the starting point, the percentage of households in poverty has been reduced by 39 percent, from 42.8 percent to 26 percent. Extreme poverty fell by over half, from 16.6 percent to seven percent.

Quote:
Health
Venezuelans, especially children, have benefited from the government’s social policies over the past decade through improved health outcomes. As shown in Figure 4, infant mortality has decreased by over one-third, falling from 21.4 to 14.2 deaths per 1,000 live births. Likewise, child mortality has fallen by over one-third, from 26.5 to 17.0 deaths per 1,000 live births. The greatest benefit has been for children between the ages of one and eleven months: postneonatal mortality has been cut by more than half, falling from 9.0 to 4.2 deaths per 1,000 live births.
Quote:
Government Finance and Current Account
Government revenues have benefited enormously from the rising price of oil until last year; world oil prices rose from an average of $19.3 per barrel in 1999 to $99.7 per barrel in 2008.9 However, it is worth noting that non-oil revenue also increased significantly as a percentage of GDP over the decade, from 11.7 percent of GDP in 1998 to 14.2 percent of GDP in 2007. This was due to improved tax collection.
Revenue and spending are shown in Table 5. As can be seen, revenue increased from 17.4 percent of GDP in 1998 to 28.7 percent of GDP in 2007. Spending also increased, from 21.4 to 25.7 percent of GDP over this period. The government ran a fiscal surplus of 3 percent of GDP for 2007; there are still no official figures available for 2008.
It is important to note that not all government spending is included in these figures for central government finances. Much of the government’s spending has, in recent years, been carried out directly from PDVSA, the state oil company. For example, in the first three quarters of 2008 (January through September) PDVSA had $13.9 billion, or 6.1 percent of GDP in public expenditures.
It is also worth noting that real (inflation-adjusted) social spending per person more than tripled from 1998-2006.10
Over the decade, the government’s total public debt has fallen from 30.7 to 14.3 percent of GDP. The foreign public debt has fallen even more, from 25.6 to 9.8 percent of GDP.
By the way, I heard somewhere that this report may have been presented through the "positive thinking" lens, so to speak. I also heard that inflation has gone up significantly recently.

In spite of that, I'm impressed with a government that has successfully risen so many people out of poverty and improved health outcomes and education. It's a start and places people on the right track. South America is blooming. Not everything will be perfect, but social democracies work.
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Old 06-13-2011, 09:15 AM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by Ocean View Post
I'm not sure how to interpret the graph you showed to support your points above (?), but I looked at the document you linked to and I was impressed with a number of facts of which I wasn't aware.

Here are some samples:








By the way, I heard somewhere that this report may have been presented through the "positive thinking" lens, so to speak. I also heard that inflation has gone up significantly recently.

In spite of that, I'm impressed with a government that has successfully risen so many people out of poverty and improved health outcomes and education. It's a start and places people on the right track. South America is blooming. Not everything will be perfect, but social democracies work.
Apparently Chavez fanboy (and girl)ism is growing more common on the left.

How about crime:
http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/201...cas/VENEZ.html
How about Chavez's antisemitism:
http://www.forbes.com/2009/02/13/cha...an_schoen.html
How about his buddying up with Iran and Syria:
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Ameri...uclear-program

Here's a freedomhouse excerpt from last year's report on your totally cool tyrant:
"In February 2009, referendum voters approved reforms backed by President Hugo Chavez Frias that abolished term limits for the presidency and other elected offices. Nevertheless, a weak economy, continued political polarization, and problems with the provision of key public services led to increased street protests during the year. Meanwhile, new laws threatened to further marginalize the political opposition, and tensions with Colombia increased the risk of armed conflict."
Full report:
http://www.freedomhouse.org/template...=363&year=2010

There are countries in South America that are doing quite well--Colombia, Chile, Uruguay. Then there's Venezuela. If you think Chavez is doing a great job then God help America if your ideal comes here.

A bit more:
http://www.economist.com/node/17796581
http://www.economist.com/blogs/ameri...vezs_venezuela
http://www.economist.com/node/17527250

Last edited by operative; 06-13-2011 at 09:19 AM..
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  #17  
Old 06-13-2011, 12:39 PM
sugarkang sugarkang is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by Ocean View Post
In spite of that, I'm impressed with a government that has successfully risen so many people out of poverty and improved health outcomes and education. It's a start and places people on the right track. South America is blooming. Not everything will be perfect, but social democracies work.
Okay, let me put it to you in a different context.
Venezuela has 26.8 million residents.
The oil sector accounts for roughly 12% of GDP, 94% of export earnings, and more than half of the central government's ordinary revenues.
Venezuela's GDP is $326 billion. x 12% = $39 billion
That's a ballpark $1,450 for every Venezuelan resident each year.
But wait, that's not that much money, right?
GDP per capita is $13,500.

If 12% of your economy is free money, isn't it kind of like saying: you know Chavez is improving a lot of things considering he only wins the lottery every single day.

The question isn't whether or not natural resources should be nationalized or privatized. The question is what a nation is capable of, in terms of self-preservation, without oil wealth. Japan and South Korea have almost nothing in terms of natural, raw materials. What would happen to Venezuela without all that oil?

It's the same stupid argument that liberals make about Norway. "Oh, but Norway doesn't use that money. It saves it!" Well, these people don't have any concept of money. If you save money, it's cheaper for you to borrow because you're solvent. If money comes out of the ground for free, it's easier for you to save and thus cheaper for you to borrow.
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Old 06-13-2011, 08:13 PM
Ocean Ocean is offline
 
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Default Re: Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis

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Originally Posted by sugarkang View Post
Okay, let me put it to you in a different context.
Venezuela has 26.8 million residents.
The oil sector accounts for roughly 12% of GDP, 94% of export earnings, and more than half of the central government's ordinary revenues.
Venezuela's GDP is $326 billion. x 12% = $39 billion
That's a ballpark $1,450 for every Venezuelan resident each year.
But wait, that's not that much money, right?
GDP per capita is $13,500.

If 12% of your economy is free money, isn't it kind of like saying: you know Chavez is improving a lot of things considering he only wins the lottery every single day.

The question isn't whether or not natural resources should be nationalized or privatized. The question is what a nation is capable of, in terms of self-preservation, without oil wealth. Japan and South Korea have almost nothing in terms of natural, raw materials. What would happen to Venezuela without all that oil?

It's the same stupid argument that liberals make about Norway. "Oh, but Norway doesn't use that money. It saves it!" Well, these people don't have any concept of money. If you save money, it's cheaper for you to borrow because you're solvent. If money comes out of the ground for free, it's easier for you to save and thus cheaper for you to borrow.
You got yourself swimming in numbers when the point that I made was far more simple, and less mathematically intricate, than that.

Venezuela has had oil for a long time now. However, it's been Chavez (who is not by any means my hero) and his government that have managed to make the necessary changes that diverted a significant amount of wealth towards improving education, health and decreasing the income gap in the population. The same resources could have been directed towards all kinds of other things that would not have produced the same result.

I know there's no mystery or magic about what he's done. I just pointed out that increasing the well being of many was impressive. And by the way, whenever I hear GDP per capita I also want to hear income distribution.
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Old 06-13-2011, 09:48 PM
operative operative is offline
 
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You got yourself swimming in numbers when the point that I made was far more simple, and less mathematically intricate, than that.
And far less correct. You really should pay closer attention.
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  #20  
Old 06-09-2011, 09:08 PM
Bill Scher Bill Scher is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

Just doing my part to start a "liberals love law and order" stereotype.

I'll save my outrage for when I have all the facts, and find some related perspective, thanks.
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Old 06-09-2011, 11:22 PM
Diane1976 Diane1976 is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Just doing my part to start a "liberals love law and order" stereotype.

I'll save my outrage for when I have all the facts, and find some related perspective, thanks.
Liberals are kind of obsessed with having all the facts and credible expertise, such as the weight of opinion in a given professional field, before they venture out on any limbs.

This is absolutely proper and right, but it's amazing how far the so-called conservatives of today can get without any facts, or making them up as they go along.
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Old 06-10-2011, 10:17 AM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by Diane1976 View Post
Liberals are kind of obsessed with having all the facts and credible expertise, such as the weight of opinion in a given professional field, before they venture out on any limbs.

This is absolutely proper and right, but it's amazing how far the so-called conservatives of today can get without any facts, or making them up as they go along.
That leads liberals to adopt groupthink more often than conservatives (see: education). The so-called experts in the education field are devoid of creativity, ingenuity, or sense. A group of political scientists or engineers are far more capable of improving the system than the group of fools teaching education in universities.

It's not unique to the education field. In any field there are going to be orthodoxies that develop whether they're valid or not, and most will be loath to reevaluate them. That's why it took Paul O'Neill, someone without a background in health care, to advance infection prevention in hospitals.
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Old 06-10-2011, 11:07 AM
bkjazfan bkjazfan is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by Diane1976 View Post
Liberals are kind of obsessed with having all the facts and credible expertise, such as the weight of opinion in a given professional field, before they venture out on any limbs.

This is absolutely proper and right, but it's amazing how far the so-called conservatives of today can get without any facts, or making them up as they go along.
It appears to me that those having uninformed opinions cover a broad ideological spectrum.

Last edited by bkjazfan; 06-10-2011 at 02:10 PM..
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  #24  
Old 06-10-2011, 05:07 PM
Tara Davis Tara Davis is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by Bill Scher View Post
Just doing my part to start a "liberals love law and order" stereotype.

I'll save my outrage for when I have all the facts, and find some related perspective, thanks.
So the few facts that we have, that of door-kickers with guns raiding homes on behalf of the Department of Education, is not enough to spur outrage for you?

Maybe now that Balko is watching the watchers as a member of the HuffPo staff instead of with the libertarian crackpots at Reason, some liberals might finally start to notice that the US has morphed into a shockingly militarized police state over the past 20 years.

SWAT raids for non-violent offenders is pretty much the opposite of what I would call "law and order." It's a government of thuggery.
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Old 06-10-2011, 05:25 PM
AemJeff AemJeff is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by Tara Davis View Post
So the few facts that we have, that of door-kickers with guns raiding homes on behalf of the Department of Education, is not enough to spur outrage for you?

Maybe now that Balko is watching the watchers as a member of the HuffPo staff instead of with the libertarian crackpots at Reason, some liberals might finally start to notice that the US has morphed into a shockingly militarized police state over the past 20 years.

SWAT raids for non-violent offenders is pretty much the opposite of what I would call "law and order." It's a government of thuggery.
It would be good to know what warrants the "door-kickers" were holding, and what exactly "on behalf of the Department of Education" signifies before we exercised our preemptive outrage reflexes, wouldn't it?
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  #26  
Old 06-10-2011, 05:52 PM
badhatharry badhatharry is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Maybe now that Balko is watching the watchers as a member of the HuffPo staff instead of with the libertarian crackpots at Reason, ...
This fairly drips of sarcasm. good job.
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  #27  
Old 06-10-2011, 08:09 PM
Tara Davis Tara Davis is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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This fairly drips of sarcasm. good job.
Well-spotted. They say it's hard to convey via text.
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  #28  
Old 06-11-2011, 08:31 AM
DenvilleSteve DenvilleSteve is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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... SWAT raids for non-violent offenders is pretty much the opposite of what I would call "law and order." It's a government of thuggery.
to be fair, it is dangerous for law inforcement officials to enter the home, unannounced, of someone engaged in illegal activity. You don't know how they will react. You don't know what other illegal activity they may be engaged in. Maybe they could set up a safehouse across the street and conduct pre raid surveillance, but that would be too costly. At a minimum, don't be deceived by the activists and buy into the meme that the raided household's only offense was not paying their student loans on time.
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  #29  
Old 06-12-2011, 08:50 PM
Parallax Parallax is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Just doing my part to start a "liberals love law and order" stereotype.

I'll save my outrage for when I have all the facts, and find some related perspective, thanks.
Well that is a nice partisan excuse.

Imagine the following scenario: It is 2007, the family in question was muslim the raid was done by FBI who were looking for a terrorist who was not there. Would you still save your outrage? Would you wait to see if FBI actions were permitted by the patriot act?
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  #30  
Old 06-09-2011, 09:20 PM
badhatharry badhatharry is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

Megan McArdle is such a bummer. She obviously doesn't appreciate the patriotic significance (wasn't that Bill's term?) of the auto bail outs.
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  #31  
Old 06-10-2011, 12:18 AM
eeeeeeeli eeeeeeeli is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

Yes, teachers will keep getting screwed by Obama because everyone hates them. And everyone hates them because they do such a lousy job with our kids. Have you seen the test scores? Our precious, precious children.

The odd thing is: everyone seems to know exactly what needs to happen in education but the teachers. Why won't they listen? Everyone else seems to agree - the pundits, the media, the think tanks on the left and right, the public. How is it that the people who actually spend their days and nights worrying about teaching children just won't get it?

Oh yeah - it's their fat greedy salaries! Pshttt.... school teachers.
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  #32  
Old 06-10-2011, 08:01 AM
Ocean Ocean is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Yes, teachers will keep getting screwed by Obama because everyone hates them. And everyone hates them because they do such a lousy job with our kids. Have you seen the test scores? Our precious, precious children.

The odd thing is: everyone seems to know exactly what needs to happen in education but the teachers. Why won't they listen? Everyone else seems to agree - the pundits, the media, the think tanks on the left and right, the public. How is it that the people who actually spend their days and nights worrying about teaching children just won't get it?

Oh yeah - it's their fat greedy salaries! Pshttt.... school teachers.
It's just so easy for everybody to gang up on that one group. Anyone would think that they represent authority figures who used to rule many hours of everybody's childhood and that later on they receive the suppressed anger that has been kept so hidden in the subconscious mind.
... ...

Oh! Wait! Now that I think about it ...

...
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  #33  
Old 06-10-2011, 09:38 AM
badhatharry badhatharry is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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It's just so easy for everybody to gang up on that one group. Anyone would think that they represent authority figures who used to rule many hours of everybody's childhood and that later on they receive the suppressed anger that has been kept so hidden in the subconscious mind.
... ...

Oh! Wait! Now that I think about it ...

...
points to ponder.
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  #34  
Old 06-10-2011, 09:37 AM
badhatharry badhatharry is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Yes, teachers will keep getting screwed by Obama because everyone hates them. And everyone hates them because they do such a lousy job with our kids. Have you seen the test scores? Our precious, precious children.
Is Obama screwing the teachers? I didn't watch that part.

What do you think of Michelle Rhee?
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  #35  
Old 06-10-2011, 09:59 AM
eeeeeeeli eeeeeeeli is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Is Obama screwing the teachers? I didn't watch that part.

What do you think of Michelle Rhee?
Bill mentioned in passing that the one labor group Obama doesn't seem to mind needling is teachers. I think with other labor groups, their job is so much simpler, that supporting them is a no-brainer for Democrats. But education has become really messy. A huge ideological gulf has opened up between the Democratic establishment (which has essentially moved to the center-right, behind Republicans) and the teaching profession.

The one thing I'll admire about Michelle Rhee is her passion and desire to shake things up. But I find her tone and assumptions about the politics of teaching incredibly simplistic and condescending.

Which is my larger view of the education debate in general. You have this really complicated situation with a ton of variables and unknowns, and because it is so important (essentially about social justice writ large), people are open to incredibly disruptive and top-down "solutions" that have created both pedagogical as well as political havok throughout public education.

A ton of interest-groups have lined up behind incredibly rigid ideologies which are basically unproven, and require massive amounts of spin to keep afloat. The one optimistic take-away I still have is that the public seems to recognize more than ever the connection between freedom and human development. I just wish we'd move beyond asking one teacher with a class of 40+ to be the guarantor of American liberty.
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  #36  
Old 06-10-2011, 10:09 AM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Bill mentioned in passing that the one labor group Obama doesn't seem to mind needling is teachers. I think with other labor groups, their job is so much simpler, that supporting them is a no-brainer for Democrats. But education has become really messy. A huge ideological gulf has opened up between the Democratic establishment (which has essentially moved to the center-right, behind Republicans) and the teaching profession.
Obama talks tough on teachers unions but when it mattered, he and the Democrats in the Congress bowed down to the teachers unions and killed the DC voucher program, denying low income children the opportunity to have a better education.


Quote:
The one thing I'll admire about Michelle Rhee is her passion and desire to shake things up. But I find her tone and assumptions about the politics of teaching incredibly simplistic and condescending.
I think it's necessary. You can't reason with teachers unions. You have to simply go at them head on.

Quote:
Which is my larger view of the education debate in general. You have this really complicated situation with a ton of variables and unknowns, and because it is so important (essentially about social justice writ large), people are open to incredibly disruptive and top-down "solutions" that have created both pedagogical as well as political havok throughout public education.
I don't think it's all that complicated. I've laid out my set of proposals before and they'd work. You don't necessarily need to completely abolish all public schools--just establishing school choice and forcing the public schools to compete against private schools would be enough to raise the education quality tremendously. But so long as there is no competition, and so long as you have the teachers unions running the show, you will not have change.
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  #37  
Old 06-10-2011, 10:11 AM
DenvilleSteve DenvilleSteve is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by eeeeeeeli View Post
...
A ton of interest-groups have lined up behind incredibly rigid ideologies which are basically unproven, and require massive amounts of spin to keep afloat. The one optimistic take-away I still have is that the public seems to recognize more than ever the connection between freedom and human development. I just wish we'd move beyond asking one teacher with a class of 40+ to be the guarantor of American liberty.
I think at a minimum, people should have to pay what they can for the education of their children. Income over $150K, you pay the full tuition. Between $75 and $150K, you pay half price, or you get some sort of a loan to pay the tuition. The result would be more real competition and more accountability.
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  #38  
Old 06-10-2011, 10:38 AM
badhatharry badhatharry is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Originally Posted by eeeeeeeli View Post
Which is my larger view of the education debate in general. You have this really complicated situation with a ton of variables and unknowns, and because it is so important (essentially about social justice writ large), people are open to incredibly disruptive and top-down "solutions" that have created both pedagogical as well as political havok throughout public education.
Rigid ideologies. I remember, when I was teaching, that the state would come out with these ginormous books of new standards every so often. These were presented to the teachers at the beginning of the year with the expectation that they would implement them during the year. First, what was the cost involved in the production of those tomes? Second, every good teacher I knew was already implementing what they knew worked with their particular students. The good ones didn't need a bunch of paperwork and guidelines to get them to teach well. I think they viewed all of this as a pain in the neck and an intrusion into their already burdened workload.

But it sure kept the folks in Sacramento employed. What a mess.
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  #39  
Old 06-10-2011, 10:42 AM
operative operative is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

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Rigid ideologies. I remember, when I was teaching, that the state would come out with these ginormous books of new standards every so often. These were presented to the teachers at the beginning of the year with the expectation that they would implement them during the year. First, what was the cost involved in the production of those tomes? Second, every good teacher I knew was already implementing what they knew worked with their particular students. The good ones didn't need a bunch of paperwork and guidelines to get them to teach well. I think they viewed all of this as a pain in the neck and an intrusion into their already burdened workload.

But it sure kept the folks in Sacramento employed. What a mess.
The government quite enjoys maintaining inefficiencies to bolster their employment. It's why we don't have a better airport baggage check system (unlike some other countries), which would speed up the process and require fewer workers.
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  #40  
Old 06-10-2011, 12:27 AM
harkin harkin is offline
 
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Default Re: The Week in Blog: Weiner-Free Edition (Bill Scher & Kristen Soltis)

Another word for 'painful restructuring' of GM is rewarding the unions in return for campaign contributions and stiffing investors.....then going out and demonizing people with money who won't invest because they don't trust Obama. Pushing the envelope indeed.

They are continuing this incredibly destructive policy with Boeing and S Carolina.....and they still wonder why those with cash do not trust them at all.

Kristin (who usually seems either clueless or unwilling to correct Bill's BS) comes through this time. All Bill can counter with is that Obama's economy totally sucks so we have to keep throwing borrowed money at unions and pensions.
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