Bloggingheads Community

Bloggingheads Community (http://bloggingheads.tv/forum/index.php)
-   Diavlog comments (http://bloggingheads.tv/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=9)
-   -   Scarlett Johansson Edition (http://bloggingheads.tv/forum/showthread.php?t=1875)

Bloggingheads 06-12-2008 11:53 AM

Scarlett Johansson Edition
 

claymisher 06-12-2008 12:10 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Just looking at the topics this seems to be another hour of Mickey carping and caviling. I don't have the heart to actually listen to it.

Maybe someone can post dingalinks to the good parts.

Joel_Cairo 06-12-2008 12:17 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
BhTV is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful website I've ever known in my life.

houston_wood 06-12-2008 12:42 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
No. If you cannot appreciate the awesomeness of Mickey and Bob together every week like some millennial odd-couple then you should not take the time to post. The first four minutes are pure gold. Unscripted gold!

Rich 06-12-2008 12:59 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Interesting that Bob seems fine with a candidate that "just doesn't know that much about foreign policy." Isn't that the essence of his case that Bush is a world-threatening force? He abuses Mickey, yet again [yawn], for being insufficiently boosterish of Obama, and then he annihilates Barack's one piece of supposeldy credible experience: a foreign-policy position that was more sophisticated than Bush's as elucidated in a speech made in 2002. It's more ad fodder for the McCain campaign!

Rich 06-12-2008 01:05 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Let's get to the summary of Bob's analysis of the Obama campaign:
1) He doesn't know that much, or even think that much about foreign policy;
2) His associations - both short and long term - tend to be poorly chosen, but thought-out well in advance;
and
3) His speaking errors - made to either get him out of trouble, or that have the effect of binding America to commitments in the world that are untenable - are equally well-thought-out but also terrible.

Other than that, he's great!

r108dos 06-12-2008 01:28 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Mickey and Bob are my favorites. It is hard to articulate why. They ramble around and argue but thankfully the hard ideological edge isn't there. Some BHtv episodes, lets say Conn and Bill, can be a little grim (like trench warfare, maybe). Of course nothing beats UN Plaza for educational value.

graz 06-12-2008 02:06 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Scandal subject for Mickey's blog:
Sexism or Pathetic (Men)opausal longing?http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/118...&out=:00:22:12

ohcomeon 06-12-2008 02:30 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Congratulations, Joel! Do you get stock options?

bjkeefe 06-12-2008 03:07 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Talk about your role reversals -- a long stretch of Bob bashing Obama with Mickey defending him!

Well, maybe not so much of a role reversal on Bob's part. It's been a while since I've heard anything but criticism of Obama from Bob. Which is fine if that's what he genuinely has on his mind, but it's starting to sound MSMish -- an overreaction to worry about being criticized for being in the tank for Obama or for being part of the liberal media in general.

I won't go into a long diatribe about McCain's dubious staff choices or his blunders when making statements about foreign policy. I'll just say, for now, that both of these strike me as more extensive than Obama's. What I want to focus on for the moment is my wonder if Bob is going to spend the entire election season going on at length about complaints he has with Obama, to the exclusion of ever discussing problems he might (and should) have with McCain. This seems, again, uncomfortably similar to the behavior of the MSM. It reminds me of how the 2000 election was covered by the so-called liberal media -- people falling all over themselves to scrutinize and quibble with every atom of Al Gore while giving a pass to pretty much every questionable aspect of George Bush. It's as though there exists a state of mind that says, "Well, we don't need to bring up McCain's shortcomings -- everyone already knows about them." Which is exactly the way the MSM dealt with Bush, to disastrous consequences.

I'm not saying that Obama needs to be puffed here, nor that criticisms of him shouldn't be aired. I can even grant Bob's justification as he expressed it in this diavlog, that he holds Obama to a higher standard. I do, too.

I do think, however, that there needs to be some consideration of balance, and quite apart from the political sense. I'm also talking about intellectual honesty and an awareness that for all the self-deprecating remarks, the impression given by these diavlogs matters. If Bob and Mickey are going to talk horse race every diavlog from now until November, I really hope they keep this in mind.

travis68 06-12-2008 03:08 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Great diavlog. r108dos is right that it's nice there isn't a hard ideological edge and two people are open to changing their minds.

Kudos to Mickey for not ripping Bob over Bob's over-the-top moralistic diatribe on immigration last week. It turns out that Mickey wants something even *gentler* than the quoted immigration lawyer wants (and stated so in the diavlog last week). Hmmmm...maybe Mickey isn't a monster after all. Fathom that.

Anyway, Bob's diatribe was out of character for him and his insight to nonsense ratio is much higher than average, so I'll forgive him too ;)

bjkeefe 06-12-2008 03:46 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Joel:

Before anything else, let me add my congratulations to ohc's.

Let me say up front that I, personally, do not think there is a conflict of interest with you simultaneously working for BH.tv and continuing to post comments in the forums. Given the confidence in their own opinions that nearly all commenters display here, particularly regarding criticizing Bob, Mickey, or the site in general, I hardly think even a concerted campaign of pro-BH.tv sockpuppetry could be made to have any effect.

That said, it's arguable that there is at least a theoretical issue here. To that end, I have a suggestion: Use the signature field in your profile to include some sort of disclaimer. If you can't make it succinct enough, post a statement of full disclosure elsewhere, say, in the General Comments forum, and make your sig a link to this statement.

As I say, I think this is really a non-issue, so my suggestion should be thought of as about the same as dotting an I. But given that it's so easy to do, why not do it?

piscivorous 06-12-2008 03:59 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
If Senator Obama is meeting your and Mr. Wrights standards those standards can't be very high.

ohcomeon 06-12-2008 04:00 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Agreed. I am sure Bob is disappointed that Obama is not the hoped for all knowing wise man we liberals have been seeking. I spent most of the divalog thinking about the different standards the world seems to have set up for Obama and McCain. I think it is possible Bob has been following Obama's statments and has not heard much of what McCain has been saying lately. Or maybe he thinks the chance that McCain will become President is so small there is no point in listening to him.
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-t..._to_presu.html
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politic...n_N.htm?csp=34
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-t...gi_bill_i.html
http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/..._sunni_sh.html
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archi...20/787720.aspx
http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/the...nnection_1.php
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/campa...the_stump.html

bjkeefe 06-12-2008 04:13 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by piscivorous (Post 80262)
If Senator Obama is meeting your and Mr. Wrights standards those standards can't be very high.

However low they might be, they are still way above the standards I have for John McCain.

Joel_Cairo 06-12-2008 04:20 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Thanks Oh & Brendan.

I actually don't get any stock options, just the responsibility of coordinating the two heads to find a good time and sharing in the panic when something falls through at the last minute. I can tell you, though, that it was a mighty surreal moment when I answered a phonecall and the voice of Bob Wright was on the other end telling me I'd been hired. He even began with "Hi Mickey." It felt like the Twilight Zone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjkeefe (Post 80260)
To that end, I have a suggestion: Use the signature field in your profile to include some sort of disclaimer. If you can't make it succinct enough, post a statement of full disclosure elsewhere, say, in the General Comments forum, and make your sig a link to this statement.

Yeah I like this idea Brendan. What I've got now is, well, pretty succinct & to the point. Perhaps too much so. I'm not sure what else to include. Once it's disclosed it's disclosed, I guess, and other people reading my comments can give that fact whatever weight they deem relevant.

Michael Renhard 06-12-2008 04:24 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
I do not agree with Robin Wright's argument that it is unfair that illegal aliens being deported for “ignoring deportation orders that they have not even been informed of,” a situation which comes about because many or even most of the trials take place in absentia with the defendant learning of neither the trial itself or the result.

But surely the reason they are tried in absentia is that they are not where they have told immigration they are going to be? Moreover, are not the ‘trials’ simply administrative exercises to certify that the person in question has overstayed his visa?

If you come into a country on the basis of a promise that you are leaving after 6 months and seven months comes around you know you broken the rule and your word. Saying that they should not be held liable or blameworthy for ignoring an order ignores the fact that they were tried in absentia precisely because they were not where they said they would be. They surely know they have broken the law. That is why they are tried in absentia. They are have ignored the summons or made it otherwise impossible for the summons to reach them. Given that, the person complaining about being expelled for violating an order for a trial they didn’t get to attend and whose verdict they were not informed of is in the position of a person skipping out on child support payments complaining that they don’t get a Christmas card.

By the way, I fully agree with your (Robin’s) analogy between US employers creating the demand for illegal aliens and johns who create the demand for prostitutes. I think that prosecuting the party that creates the demand for the illegal activity is by far a more efficient way to end an undesirable pattern of activity. More efficient and more politically costly. That is why we so seldom do it. Could a compromise on the immigration issue between liberals and conservatives be built around the liberals agreeing to any measures however draconian if we make sure that those sanctions fall on employers and other US citizens rather than the foreigners.

Wonderment 06-12-2008 04:45 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

I nearly choked on my lunch when I heard Obama's Jerusalem comment .
Ditto. It was my first moment of real shock in the entire campaign (and I'm quite the cynic). דרישת- שלום

handle 06-12-2008 04:49 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Joel_Cairo (Post 80267)
Thanks Oh & Brendan.

I actually don't get any stock options, just the responsibility of coordinating the two heads to find a good time and sharing in the panic when something falls through at the last minute. I can tell you, though, that it was a mighty surreal moment when I answered a phonecall and the voice of Bob Wright was on the other end telling me I'd been hired. He even began with "Hi Mickey." It felt like the Twilight Zone.

That is sooo cool! I too add congrats and this pearl:
Like any of us are going to have a problem with this powerful addition to our arsenal, the ability to completely dismiss the validity of a comment by merely pointing out the fact that the commenter is employed by the site!
Not that I personally would actively engage...
I just want to add if I'm ever in the same position, please don't out me as I would no doubt be pummeled for dodgy and irreverent posting practices. Wait, that just means nothing would change.... strike that...

Tao Jones 06-12-2008 04:52 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
I think Frasier is a schnoodle, (1/2 schnauzer 1/2 poodle). My ex has a dog that looks just like him.

Wonderment 06-12-2008 05:00 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Awesome gig, Joel.

You deserve it just for being the champion of all working ding-a-links stiffs.

You've been my idol since the Jonah Goldberg commpasionate conservative mosquito swat, which was not just one of the greatest moments of BHTV but of all TV ever.


DISCLAIMER

I always kiss up to staff with access to deletion buttons.

Wonderment 06-12-2008 05:16 PM

Why does Mickey hate that Wonder Person?
 
¿Por qué me odias, Mickey? Qué te he hecho yo a ti? Nada. Nunca.

Yo tengo todos mis documentos en orden. Por favor, no mandes la migra a mi casa para sacarme de mi camita a las cuatro de la mañana, subirme a un camión gris con los vidrios tintados, separarme de mi familia y llevarme a Tijuana. Prometo ya nunca volver a criticarte, con tal de que no seas rata y no me denuncies a los agentes de ICE. Mil gracias por adelantado, "That Wonder Person"

Wonderment 06-12-2008 05:34 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Could a compromise on the immigration issue between liberals and conservatives be built around the liberals agreeing to any measures however draconian if we make sure that those sanctions fall on employers and other US citizens rather than the foreigners?
A better way is to set a goal of open borders (a la European Union) between Mexico and the US by the year 2025. A "change candidate" could lead this effort. Eventually, we would have a system that allowed for Mexican working families to travel freely, work here (especially at jobs more highly-educated Americans tend to reject like agriculture), and NO ONE would be punished, draconianaly or otherwise. Sí, se puede. Yes, we can.

Mickey likes to use the word "amnesty" as an obscenity, but legalization of working families and a path to citizenship or permanent residence would benefit both the US and Mexico, provided it's carried out in the context of an overall plan of cooperation between Mex and the US (call it the North American Free People Agreement, NAFPA).

bjkeefe 06-12-2008 05:39 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Wonderment:

Quote:

A better way is to set a goal of open borders ...
Instinctively, this appeals to me, too. But what about the other direction? Should, for example, Mexican factories be required to share the same environmental and labor practice standards? It is my impression that the EU has a lot to say about uniform requirements for member countries, in addition to easing restrictions on cross-border travel.

Wonderment 06-12-2008 05:45 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Instinctively, this appeals to me, too. But what about the other direction? Should, for example, Mexican factories be required to share the same environmental and labor practice standards? It is my impression that the EU has a lot to say about uniform requirements for member countries, in addition to easing restrictions on cross-border travel.
Yes, this is a big project on a lot of fronts that will take a couple of decades at least. Look how long it took post-war Europe.

bjkeefe 06-12-2008 05:47 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wonderment (Post 80287)
Yes, this is a big project on a lot of fronts that will take a couple of decades at least. Look how long it took post-war Europe.

Agreed. Just checking.

Wonderment 06-12-2008 06:12 PM

Bob, We love Frazier...
 
But are you sure all her (his?) papers are in order?

With Mickey's discriminatory language seeping into your discourse

I'm worried that Frasier may have illegally entered the country, unbeknownest to the MinuteKlan patrolling our northern borders. S(he) does look a little French, mon frere.

Namazu 06-12-2008 06:19 PM

It's the multi-trillion dollar bailout, stupid!
 
Bob and Mickey miss the point on Jim Johnson. Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and the FHA are essentially sucking up the country's entire mortgage pool and are likely face insolvency in the next few years. Agency bonds are now (in-all-but-name) backed by the full faith and credit of the United States government, i.e., you the taxpayer. Expect the mother of all financial meltdowns, the mother of all bailouts, and--if any of these crooks are allowed anywhere near the government--the mother of all conflicts of interests.

To see what's coming, read Mish Shedlock:

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/

travis68 06-12-2008 07:00 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Questions for Wonderment...

My own ideal would be a world without borders and free immigration everywhere absent a criminal record or criminal intent. Is it fair to say that you share my view? Otherwise I can't understand the Minuteman cracks. If we are going to restrict immigration, it doesn't seem fair that one country (Mexico) have privileges that other countries don't.

Furthermore, would you advocate complete openness with China? If not, why not?

Bobby G 06-12-2008 08:43 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Just out of curiosity, why open borders just with Mexico? Is it the physical and/or cultural propinquity? If not just with Mexico, then with who? Every country? Some but not all?

brucds 06-12-2008 08:48 PM

Re: Obama's AIPAC "gaffe"
 
Hamas "unendorsed" Obama after his Jerusalem comment.

Mission accomplished...

Rich 06-12-2008 08:51 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
We could accomplish this much faster by simply annexing Mexico as the 51st state. After all, if we've got no borders and anyone can go in or out of the country as they pleased, how would that be different from Mexican statehood? There'd be no messy sorting out of what laws apply where - they'd be subject to the same federal laws all other states would, and they could have the nominal freedoms reserved for the states. Just change the highway signs to English and away we go! We could finish the job tomorrw. Plus, the new southern border would be sooo much easier to fence off. [It can't be racist to close that border: the Mexicans do it. Si, they puede.]

Wonderment 06-12-2008 09:43 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Please see my reply to the same question asked by Travis68 below.

harkin 06-12-2008 09:51 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Congrats Bob, the look of terror on Smokin Joe's little mug is diminishing.

deebee 06-12-2008 09:55 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Pre-firing, Obama's response to the Johnson controversy:

You don't have to vet the vetter.
It's not a job.

Post firing explanation:

He's not the same sub-prime lender that I once knew.
(Okay, I made this one up, but you get my drift.)

Wonderment 06-12-2008 09:59 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Questions for Wonderment... My own ideal would be a world without borders and free immigration everywhere absent a criminal record or criminal intent. Is it fair to say that you share my view?
Yes, I share your view.

Quote:

If we are going to restrict immigration, it doesn't seem fair that one country (Mexico) have privileges that other countries don't.
Mexico, like Canada, shares a long border and geo-political history with us. Our experiences, cultures and economies are intimately interrelated, so Mexico and Canada are good places to start in our effort to promote a world without borders.

Furthermore, with Mexico we are looking for a just resolution of the problem of undocumented immigrant families, millions of whom currently live in the USA in limbo, subject to arrest and deportation.

It's true that we have to look at the problem of undocumented working families holistically, whether they are Haitian, Paraguayan, Somalian, Polish or Mexican. But the fact of the matter is that today they are overwhelmingly Mexican, so we are most likely to make significant progress by respecting the rights to a path to citizenship for all working families, independent of national origin, while simultaneously focusing on bilateral accords with Mexico.

Wonderment 06-12-2008 10:09 PM

Re: Obama's AIPAC "gaffe"
 
Quote:

Hamas "unendorsed" Obama after his Jerusalem comment. Mission accomplished...
He could have accomplished that mission without making a fool of himself and alienating the rest of the Arab/Muslim world. (He could have just said he didn't agree that Jews were to blame for the French and Communist Revolutions, Colonialism, as well as Rotary and Lions Clubs).

Article 22 of the Hamas Charter:

Quote:

For a long time, the enemies have been planning, skillfully and with precision, for the achievement of what they have attained. ...With their money, they took control of the world media, news agencies, the press, publishing houses, broadcasting stations, and others. ... They were behind the French Revolution, the Communist revolution and most of the revolutions we heard and hear about, here and there. With their money they formed secret societies, such as Freemasons, Rotary Clubs, the Lions and others.... With their money they were able to control imperialistic countries and instigate them to colonize many countries in order to enable them to exploit their resources and spread corruption there.

....They were behind World War I, ...They were behind World War II, ... It was they who instigated the replacement of the League of Nations with the United Nations and the Security Council to enable them to rule the world through them. There is no war going on anywhere, without having their finger in it.

Glaurunge 06-12-2008 10:19 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Joel_Cairo (Post 80235)
BhTV is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful website I've ever known in my life.

So Joel Cairo not only has a conflict of interest, but evidently is also a sleeper agent planted by the Chinese to take out Bob Wright in order that Mickey can ascend to the top of the Bloggingheads media empire.

harkin 06-12-2008 10:28 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
13:01 is a lot to be unaccounted for.

AemJeff 06-12-2008 10:47 PM

Re: Scarlett Johansson Edition
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wonderment (Post 80278)
DISCLAIMER
I always kiss up to staff with access to deletion buttons.

<laughing>


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:23 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.