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Bloggingheads 09-14-2011 04:04 PM

Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 

chamblee54 09-14-2011 05:49 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Eli Lake makes a mistake. Some poet needs to run with that.
There is a tendency to label all terror groups as Al Queda. Mr. Lake says, almost as an afterthought, "and affiliated groups".
One problem with this thinking is that while America spends trillions of dollars to waste the last dozen people in Al Queda, these other terror groups are flourishing.
chamblee54

sugarkang 09-14-2011 06:34 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Haha. Eli's with the Daily Beast!

graz 09-14-2011 07:14 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sugarkang (Post 225698)
Haha. Eli's with the Daily Beast!

Haha. Kang's with the law firm of Sitaround, Postallday & Dolittlelse.

Ocean 09-14-2011 09:33 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Great interview!

It's another huge black hole through which our wealth goes. Like John said, if his book helps to start a conversation on this topic it would be a great success. Indeed.

Rathertired 09-14-2011 11:56 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
I have very little sympathy for the neocon foreign policy Eli Lake comes out of (and still supports), but I have to give it up: he's always professional, prepared, considerate and a fine BHTV guest. Perhaps that's because Lake's a real journalist and fully formed adult.

Oh, if only we could say the same thing about the folks who appear on BHTV who come out of the (in my mind) equally discredited economic policies of the right!

Strange that the neocon foreign policy BHTV fall-back guy (Eli Lake) should, in fact, be intelligent, considerate and competent whereas the Fox, Washington Examiner, NRO, Cato and various "one degree of separation from Megan McArdle" libertarians who talk economics (and graphic novels and cable comedies) always seem profoundly - tellingly - silly, juvenile and in over their heads.

[See Jim Pinkerton's recent inability to grasp the obvious ramifications of supporting an anti-bailout, anti-regulating-Wall-Street policy.]

And I'm not pro-Lake because he's a pushover. Far from it. I'd have to concede he won all his points of contention.

harkin 09-15-2011 10:42 AM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rathertired (Post 225726)
.......Fox, Washington Examiner, NRO, Cato and various "one degree of separation from Megan McArdle" libertarians who talk economics (and graphic novels and cable comedies) always seem profoundly - tellingly - silly, juvenile and in over their heads.

As opposed to the left, who elect/appoint these types POTUS, senator, congressmen/women, governor, attorney general, judge ....etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rathertired
inability to grasp the obvious ramifications

See above and google Stimulus I, Cash For Clunkers, Operation Fast & Furious, GM Bailout to the unions that made it insolvent, Payback of the GM Bailout with govt money, Solyndra, Stimulus II (AKA Jobs Act lol AKA Blue State Bailout)....etc.

Rathertired 09-15-2011 11:03 AM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Well, at least you're not plagiarizing anyone or making up stuff about the NY Times today, Harkin. Good for you! We're seeing some real improvement!

Alas, you seem incapable of even grasping the essential point about Pinkerton's bonkers posision. I'll try not to go too fast for you. If there'd been no bailout (if your beloved Bush hadn't enacted Paulson's TARP plan and bailed out Wall Street while, you know - this is the funny part - "socializing" banks and stuff) there might've been another great depression. With no effort to limit the size; interconnectedness; mad speculating; dubious, comically complex nature of untested financial instruments or the bonus culture of financial institutions in the 21st century it could very well happen again.

Okay, then. Feel free to now place an irrelevant link or two, rant about something else (as you don't understand what has been written) or otherwise repeat something you recently heard on talk radio or Fox that bears no connection to the point or either of my posts!

That's the Harkin way! And, gosh, it's cute!

badhatharry 09-15-2011 11:45 AM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rathertired (Post 225753)
Alas, you seem incapable of even grasping the essential point about Pinkerton's bonkers posision. I'll try not to go too fast for you.

See when someone spells position phonetically is casts a pall over everything else they have to say, especially when they are trying to be a smarty pants.

Quote:

If there'd been no bailout (if your beloved Bush hadn't enacted Paulson's TARP plan and bailed out Wall Street while, you know - this is the funny part - "socializing" banks and stuff) there might've been another great depression.
Might have been another depression...that pretty much sums up the rationale for everything that has been done since 2008. No one questions it. It is fact...or should I say counterfact. But never mind, we'll just keep going with it.

Quote:

With no effort to limit the size; interconnectedness; mad speculating; dubious, comically complex nature of untested financial instruments or the bonus culture of financial institutions in the 21st century it could very well happen again.
Right and I'm sure that we'll come up with some sure-fired way to prevent anything bad from ever happening in the future. I know, let's create another agency and pass more regulations! That'll do the trick.

ledocs 09-16-2011 08:26 AM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
I have asked for more dv's like this one -- author interviews. This was fine. The book does not seem startling in its conclusions.

I hope the number of comments here does not accurately reflect the number of viewers and does not represent a rejection by consumers of diavlogs of this sort.

Ocean 09-16-2011 08:58 AM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ledocs (Post 225844)
I have asked for more dv's like this one -- author interviews. This was fine. The book does not seem startling in its conclusions.

I hope the number of comments here does not accurately reflect the number of viewers and does not represent a rejection by consumers of diavlogs of this sort.

It's been observed before that very interesting diavlogs don't necessarily generate lots of comments. Arguing or going off topic generate tons of comments, but certain topics or interviewees don't elicit any of those.

bkjazfan 09-16-2011 09:30 AM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
I have listened to 2/3's of it and plan to finish it off today. So far, I see another reason for the federal government to be swimmming in red ink.

Florian 09-16-2011 12:48 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ledocs (Post 225844)
I have asked for more dv's like this one -- author interviews. This was fine. The book does not seem startling in its conclusions.

I hope the number of comments here does not accurately reflect the number of viewers and does not represent a rejection by consumers of diavlogs of this sort.

I listened with intense interest. But I have to admit that nothing John Mueller said surprised me in the least. I am glad someone has crunched the figures and stated the obvious: that the "war on terror" is one of the biggest boondoggles in American history, although I suppose it has provided gainful employment to many in a time of unemployment.

miceelf 09-16-2011 01:16 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Great discussion and thought-provoking. I am probably somewhere between the two, perhaps closer to Mr. Mueller, but Lake as usual was a very good interlocutor.

stephanie 09-16-2011 03:07 PM

Re: Lessons Learned: The Real Costs of Terrorism (John Mueller & Eli Lake)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Florian (Post 225853)
I listened with intense interest. But I have to admit that nothing John Mueller said surprised me in the least. I am glad someone has crunched the figures and stated the obvious: that the "war on terror" is one of the biggest boondoggles in American history, although I suppose it has provided gainful employment to many in a time of unemployment.

Yeah, it wasn't surprising to me either, but it was an interesting discussion, and on the broader topic I'm glad we might finally be ready to have a discussion about this issue. Like they said toward the end, it's been almost taboo.

It also demonstrated why I like Eli so much. He was a good interviewer -- asking the kinds of questions and raising the kinds of objections or "what about this" points that I wanted raised. But more than that, he seems to find interesting people with different points of view than I suspect he has and have good conversations with them.

bjkeefe 09-20-2011 10:14 AM

I have been waiting ten years ...
 
... for a discussion like this. Thanks to John for putting the numbers together and presenting them so clearly and thanks to Eli for a fine interview.


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