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Bloggingheads 08-25-2009 10:00 PM

Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 

TwinSwords 08-25-2009 10:08 PM

Sadly, No! on Radley Balko
 
I believe this was posted in the Whole Foods boycott thread, but here it is again for anyone who hasn't seen it:

But, But, John Mackey Is Nice To Bunny Rabbits

uncle ebeneezer 08-26-2009 12:01 AM

Re: How to Ruin Your Conservative Cred!
 
Next Thing You Know He'll Probably Admit To Drinking Latte!!

rcocean 08-26-2009 12:15 AM

Pauline Kael Syndrome
 
I wonder if Matt has it? Charles Murray thinks the White House does.

stephanie 08-26-2009 09:01 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
I really enjoyed this one (although Matt should work on not interrupting so much, and I don't know that I wanted to know that he has freakishly small teeth). I found a lot to agree with in the discussion on criminal law and civil rights and the political issues surrounding that. However, I wish there'd been a little more on the background and some of the political pressures which drive what's been going on.

On health care, I found a lot to agree with there too, although it also seemed a little superficial. Matt is right about the political pressures on that one, which is a shame, but once again in hearing people talk about the problems with the cost incentives in our current system (which I fully agree with them about), I wish we could have a wonkish discussion between perhaps someone prepared to talk about how these problems are dealt with successfully in numerous other countries (not just the oft slammed UK or Canada) through alternatives to what seems to be the more free market proposals here. (Edit: not that any of these, any more than the free market proposals, has a chance of working politically, because of the loss adversion problem plus willingness of both sides -- the Republicans oh, so cynically -- to politicize the Medicare aspects.)

DenvilleSteve 08-26-2009 10:17 AM

self employed can deduct insurance premiums
 
as I understand it persons who are self employed can deduct their health insurance premiums:
http://taxes.about.com/od/deductions...hinsurance.htm

What I think is nuts about the tax code and health care is you cant deduct your out of pocket expenses ( below a very high threshold ). This reduces the economic desirability of high deductible insurance.

So sure, in a revenue neutral way, eliminate the deductibility of health insurance for all.

DenvilleSteve 08-26-2009 10:29 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stephanie (Post 126729)
(Edit: not that any of these, any more than the free market proposals, has a chance of working politically, because of the loss adversion problem plus willingness of both sides -- the Republicans oh, so cynically -- to politicize the Medicare aspects.)

I agree that the republicans are wrong to seemingly oppose cuts in Medicare or rationing of government paid for health care. But Obama's criticism of the McCain plan to eliminate the employee health care deduction was equally cynical and wrong.

The medicare program has to be slashed to balance the budget. I would eliminate it and replace with the Steve publicly funded health care clinics and hospitals program. Also I would deduct what medicare paid for someone's care from their estate when they check out.

jstrummer 08-26-2009 10:45 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/220...8:54&out=31:14

Ending the distortion would be half the battle. Whether you extend the tax break to individuals, or end the employer tax break, it does not matter. I'm not sure why conservatives are opposed to this.

DenvilleSteve 08-26-2009 12:26 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jstrummer (Post 126733)
http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/220...8:54&out=31:14

Ending the distortion would be half the battle. Whether you extend the tax break to individuals, or end the employer tax break, it does not matter. I'm not sure why conservatives are opposed to this.

What is the 2nd half? Perhaps the end of medicare? Where the poor, elderly or not, get rationed care they can afford in government funded clinics and the remainder of the population purchase free market care and insurance?

DenvilleSteve 08-26-2009 12:33 PM

Re: Take up Smoking
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kidneystones (Post 126707)
Matt looks like doesn't know whether to enlist and fight Obama's endless war in Afghanistan or smash some windows at Dem headquarters and blame it on the right.

Suffice to say, neither is ever likely to happen. Matt's most definitely not a sign-up and serve kind of guy anymore than Radley is.

did they talk about Afg? I missed that part. But yeah, all military service age pundits who speak in favor of sending rural Americans into battle should first stipulate that they are not willing to put themselves at risk.

bkjazfan 08-26-2009 12:35 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Knowing little about this debate I read the David Goldhill article in Atlantic. It was from a more business or libertarian polint of view. That said it was an insightful piece but most of it was beyond my level of expertise.

I like his explanation of MRI exams. I thought they were expensive due primarily being ultra high tech. Apparently, it is 20 year old technology and that is not the reason.

I suppose what I gained from the article was cost containment in healthcare is probably a canard with the various Democrat measures being put forth.

John

bkjazfan 08-26-2009 12:38 PM

Re: Take up Smoking
 
BHTV is not a gathering hole for military veterans at least not on the blogginghead side of the fence.

John

BornAgainDemocrat 08-26-2009 01:05 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Radley Balko says we spend something "like, what, 40% of our income on health care?" Hard to take him seriously after that.

DenvilleSteve 08-26-2009 01:10 PM

Wikipedia says connections enabled Ted Kennedy to avoid service in Korean War
 
interesting factoid. Ted Kennedy was expelled from Harvard for cheating in May 1951. He then enlisted in the Army. from wikipedia: "...His father's political connections ensured he was not deployed to the ongoing Korean War. ..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Kennedy

DenvilleSteve 08-26-2009 01:32 PM

Tim Geithner avoids answering Digg Dialogg questions
 
Tim Geithner responds to Digg questioners here:
http://online.wsj.com/community/dial...video_wsjprint

Alan Murray does not press him to answer the questions ( such as why did you cheat on your taxes - he says Americans have the right to ask that question. ) Geither says more than once that the deficit has to be brought way down. He says the administration is pushing health care reform to reduce the cost of HC to the government.

Now that comprehensive HCR has been defeated what do democrats do to balance the budget of their federal government? Dramatically raise taxes on the investor class just at the time the economy is coming out of a recession? Cut spending in a Congressional election year? Between a rock and a hard place, no?

KevinWho 08-26-2009 03:50 PM

Separated At Voice?
 
Am I the only one to be distracted by how much Yglesias sounds like Quentin Tarantino?

If you doubt me, try running both of these at once:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Yv8JkeEJXk
http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/220...0:12&out=01:03

graz 08-26-2009 03:59 PM

Re: Separated At Voice?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinWho (Post 126747)
Am I the only one to be distracted by how much Yglesias sounds like Quentin Tarantino?

If you doubt me, try running both of these at once:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Yv8JkeEJXk
http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/220...0:12&out=01:03

No your not the only one. Along with interupting his interlocutors, the incessant you knows, likes and sort of's, comes the frequency changing high-rising terminal . If you visit his blog you will also find that he is a poor speller. His commenters - though they respect him - ride him all the time.

But hey... He is one of his generations leading lights in the blogosphere. So there's that.

odragul 08-26-2009 04:07 PM

Journalist Matt Yglesias fails to understand basic journalistic style
 
Here is the NY Times article Yglesias references which he says fails to mention Atul Gawande or the New Yorker by name.

The first paragraph is:

Quote:

President Obama recently summoned aides to the Oval Office to discuss a magazine article investigating why the border town of McAllen, Tex., was the country’s most expensive place for health care. The article became required reading in the White House, with Mr. Obama even citing it at a meeting last week with two dozen Democratic senators.
Oh man, the Times is so pathetic!

Except, as anybody who regularly read newspapers knows, the "lede" of a newspaper story usually condenses lots of information into a tiny sentence summing up the essential information -- which is important for people who don't have time to read every word of every story. Any non-esential details are usually provided down the page. Sure enough, if you actually read the article, you'll find this 1/3-1/2 way down the page:

Quote:

The magazine article, by Dr. Atul Gawande in the June 1 issue of The New Yorker, said a major cause of the high costs in McAllen was “overuse of medical care.”
What is worse here? Is it that superstar journalist Matt Yglesias is unfamiliar with basic newspaper conventions, or that he thinks it's acceptable to mock the NY Times for an article he didn't read?

bjkeefe 08-26-2009 04:11 PM

Re: Journalist Matt Yglesias fails to understand basic journalistic style
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by odragul (Post 126749)
[...]

Nice bust.

Globalcop 08-26-2009 04:39 PM

Re: Take up Smoking
 
You don't have to serve in the military to support a war. There is certainly a place for civilians in the debate - on both sides. Not to mention, I really don't want to be in an OP with Matt. He does just fine speaking for us on BHTV.

Unit 08-26-2009 11:32 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Why don't we let WalMart distribute health-care?

ProfElwood 08-27-2009 12:53 AM

Radley bemoans liberals’ rightward shift on crime
 
Stamp out crime: make it illegal.
The United States of America has the largest prison population in the world, but only the third largest total population. Yet, any time a law fails, someone comes up with the same ideas of increasing the punishment or casting the net wider. Now we have: hate crimes; mandatory minimums; and zero-tolerance policies. All of these are meant to build on the failures of other laws.

ProfElwood 08-27-2009 02:25 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
I personally believe that most conservatives would agree with cuts, but I have no statistics to back up that belief. Republicans, on the other hand, have medical lobbyists that would fund their opponents if they did anything sensible before total disaster strikes. Democrats are in the same boat.

bjkeefe 08-27-2009 02:46 AM

Re: War? What war? A Dem President Rules
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kidneystones (Post 126891)
The world is changing. The torch has passed to Obama, according to the narrative, and all who do not find wisdom and light in his ways are racists.

Get used to it.

No, kidley. Disagreeing with Obama's policy ideas does not, in and of itself, make one a racist. I call you in particular a racist because of the specific things you have said. Take responsibility for your own deranged hatred, and stop being a coward, trying to pull other people in front of what's directed at you.

badhatharry 08-27-2009 09:16 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Someone needs to look into this David Goldhill guy. He claims to be a democrat and business man but he is saying exactly what that CEO from Whole Foods, Mackey, is saying. And yet he claims to have no agenda. Hmmmm.

He says shopping around for health care would probably encourage competition. (conservative wingnut). He points out that providers don't even know how much they charge. (ridiculous!) And that when you're spending other people's money, you're not concerned with the price (typical concervative twisting of the facts!)

This right wing infiltration in to the health care conversation has definitely gone way too far. We need to smash some windows!

badhatharry 08-27-2009 09:25 AM

Re: self employed can deduct insurance premiums
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DenvilleSteve (Post 126731)
as I understand it persons who are self employed can deduct their health insurance premiums:
http://taxes.about.com/od/deductions...hinsurance.htm

What I think is nuts about the tax code and health care is you cant deduct your out of pocket expenses ( below a very high threshold ). This reduces the economic desirability of high deductible insurance.

So sure, in a revenue neutral way, eliminate the deductibility of health insurance for all.

A self employed person can deduct health insurance premiums and out of pocket expenses, including dental visits. Or one can put a certain amount in an HSA, which is before tax dollars, and use those dollars to pay for out of pocket expenses. But you can't pay health insurance premiums with an HSA. I'm not sure why there is a distinction on that expense.

badhatharry 08-27-2009 09:49 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfElwood (Post 126913)
I personally believe that most conservatives would agree with cuts, but I have no statistics to back up that belief. Republicans, on the other hand, have medical lobbyists that would fund their opponents if they did anything sensible before total disaster strikes. Democrats are in the same boat.

Yes, unfortunately those in Washington all have special interests which they are beholding to. This keeps any meaningful and sensible change from happening. It would be nice if there could be an injection of ethical behavior administered to these elected elites. It is now an entirely incestuous situation.

Lyle 08-27-2009 10:47 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
It has always been incestous in Washington, I think.

DenvilleSteve 08-27-2009 10:54 AM

Re: self employed can deduct insurance premiums
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by badhatharry (Post 127006)
A self employed person can deduct health insurance premiums and out of pocket expenses, including dental visits. Or one can put a certain amount in an HSA, which is before tax dollars, and use those dollars to pay for out of pocket expenses. But you can't pay health insurance premiums with an HSA. I'm not sure why there is a distinction on that expense.

I thought the deduction for out of pocket medical expenses first had to exceed a percentage of your taxable income.

On HSAs, in NJ the government does not allow that type of HI. Maybe an NJ person can put money into an HSA, deduct the contributions on federal return, then use that money to pay for all out of pocket expenses?

I fear the Obama plan will take away HSAs.

badhatharry 08-27-2009 11:17 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyle (Post 127014)
It has always been incestous in Washington, I think.

Well, it is interesting to consider the possibility that humans can make decisions based on rational thought. We have so many other things which affect us, more primitive in nature.
That has always been the challenge of a democracy. The founders sought to set up a situation where decision making could be made without the pressures from 'factions'. Madison articulated this goal in the Federalist Papers by recomending a republic rather than a direct democracy. "A pure democracy ...can admit of no cure for the mischief of faction" (groups pursuing some special interest).

The problem with trying to limit lobbying is that it limits free speech, which is another right we hold dear. Having freedom is a grave responsibility and is one I think that people don't understand sufficiently.

Lyle 08-27-2009 11:25 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
I hear ya badhatharry, but as you know, even guys like Jefferson, Madison, and Adams were just men and couldn't maintain, or even reach, the standards of their best words. Washington is the same as it ever was.

badhatharry 08-27-2009 11:25 AM

Re: self employed can deduct insurance premiums
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DenvilleSteve (Post 127017)
I thought the deduction for out of pocket medical expenses first had to exceed a percentage of your taxable income.

On HSAs, in NJ the government does not allow that type of HI. Maybe an NJ person can put money into an HSA, deduct the contributions on federal return, then use that money to pay for all out of pocket expenses?

I fear the Obama plan will take away HSAs.

Well, yeah, I'm sure if you only have a few expenses they aren't deductable. However, if you are paying for your own health insurance that is going to pretty much put you in the proper percentage. I'm not sure what you mean by the rules in NJ, but I do know that once you have made a contribution to an HSA and paid doctor bills out of it, you can't claim those expenses again. That would be double dipping.

badhatharry 08-27-2009 11:55 AM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyle (Post 127021)
I hear ya badhatharry, but as you know, even guys like Jefferson, Madison, and Adams were just men and couldn't maintain, or even reach, the standards of their best words. Washington is the same as it ever was.

Well, no they couldn't reach their own standards. However, that doesn't mean we should feel free to abandon standards. There are still people who are willing to suffer for their standards.

For instance, I was recently introduced to the idea that Ron Paul is a racist. Since I happen to like the guy, I took the time to do some research about him concerning this charge. Well, it seems that someone who wrote some newsletter for him years ago wrote some stuff that could have been interpreted as racist.

But what was most interesting for me was his stance on the 1964 Civil Rights Act. He was against it. Not because, as some would accuse him of, he is a racist. But because he didn't think the federal government had the right to dictate terms to the states and to private enterprise.

Talk about political suicide!!! But this is a man who believes in things. Pretty rare these days!

AemJeff 08-27-2009 12:01 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by badhatharry (Post 127023)
...Well, it seems that someone who wrote some newsletter for him years ago wrote some stuff that could have been interpreted as racist...

That's an awfully generous interpretation of the evidence, Harry. It's not like there was an isolated instance of this, and Paul had no problem associating his name proudly on the masthead. You put a piece into a publication with your name on the cover a that contains a series of articles with no byline - you are explicitly taking responsibility for the message in those articles. Ex post facto distancing is a pretty icky tactic to take when that message becomes inconvenient.

nikkibong 08-27-2009 12:03 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AemJeff (Post 127024)
That's an awfully generous interpretation of the evidence, Harry. It's not like there was an isolated instance of this, and Paul had no problem associating his name proudly on the masthead. You put a piece into a publication with your name on the cover a that contains a series of articles with no byline - you are explicitly taking responsibility for the message in those articles. Ex post facto distancing is a pretty icky tactic to take when that message becomes inconvenient.

Not to mention Harry's pathetic formulation, "could have been interpreted as racist."

In what universe could the newsletter's statements not have been interpreted as racist?

Lyle 08-27-2009 02:52 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
In every universe likely because the newsletter is subjective commentary. It's not like the newsletter tied a black guy to itself and then dragged him along a dirt road. :)

Lyle 08-27-2009 03:01 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
I'm with you on upholding our standards, but part of standards is bending them from time to time, and quietly accepting that. A famous example would be the Louisiana Purchase which according to Jefferson's own argumentation when he was out of office would be unconstitutional. Diabolical.

Ron Paul, I'm not a huge fan of. Too absolutist for my tastes, which in my mind, shows he doesn't understand how American government and politics has always worked, but there may have been more guys like him back in the early days, or at least there have been politicians like him before, i.e., obnoxiously principled to the detriment of party politics, and likely themselves.

claymisher 08-27-2009 03:01 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by nikkibong (Post 127025)
Not to mention Harry's pathetic formulation, "could have been interpreted as racist."

In what universe could the newsletter's statements not have been interpreted as racist?

Paul's not stupid. He's not coming to come out and say "Blacks are inferior! Segregation forever!" But that's setting the bar way too low.

He's always extremely careful never to do anything that might challenge his supporters who are racists. Bigotry is never discredited. It's a cute game. You see it with Rush Limbaugh and Howard Stern too.

nikkibong 08-27-2009 03:12 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyle (Post 127039)
In every universe likely because the newsletter is subjective commentary. It's not like the newsletter tied a black guy to itself and then dragged him along a dirt road. :)

Wait, so your argument is that commentary can never be racist? Are you serious?

And WTF is with that smiley emoticon after mentioning racist murder?

What is wrong with you?

Lyle 08-27-2009 04:44 PM

Re: Wisdom Teeth and Sprained Wrists (Matthew Yglesias & Radley Balko)
 
Facetiousness man. Of course commentary can be and is racist, but it isn't objectively so, like a white guy dragging a black man from behind a truck would be.


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