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Don Zeko
09-14-2011, 10:16 AM
Anti-voter fraud measures and mid-decade redistricting are one thing, but this is just impressive. The Pennsylvania Republican Party is now pushing a plan (http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/09/gop-electoral-college-plan-beat-obama-2012) wouild give Barack Obama a minority of PA's electoral votes even if he wins the state by the margin he won it by in 2008:

Under the Republican plan—which has been endorsed by top Republicans in both houses of the state's legislature, as well as the governor, Tom Corbett—Pennsylvania would change from this system to one where each congressional district gets its own electoral vote....Under the Republican plan, if the GOP presidential nominee carries the GOP-leaning districts but Obama carries the state, the GOP nominee would get 12 electoral votes out of Pennsylvania, but Obama would only get eight—six for winning the blue districts, and two (representing the state's two senators) for carrying the state.

via (http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2011/09/new-adventures-electoral-cynicism)

Starwatcher162536
09-14-2011, 02:47 PM
I'm not worried. If Republicans really had the audacity to do this I believe it would ignite a backlash of a magnitude never before seen. Even if you want Republicans to take control, you still probably want it to be your (and others) choice. I could be wrong, but this strikes me as a bogeyman issue. Much like the Fairness doctrine.

Anyways; Popular vote ftw?

Don Zeko
09-14-2011, 11:03 PM
I'm not worried. If Republicans really had the audacity to do this I believe it would ignite a backlash of a magnitude never before seen. Even if you want Republicans to take control, you still probably want it to be your (and others) choice. I could be wrong, but this strikes me as a bogeyman issue. Much like the Fairness doctrine.

Eh, we'll see. I'm a bit more pessimistic on this one, but only time will tell. Honestly, I posted this here in hopes that some conservative would come down and defend the idea, just so that I could hear what arguments exist apart from pure partisan advantage.

Anyways; Popular vote ftw?

Pennsylvania actually has a bill to get on board with the National Popular Vote movement pending in its state senate that's being pushed aside for this nonsense.

chiwhisoxx
09-15-2011, 02:33 AM
Anti-voter fraud measures and mid-decade redistricting are one thing, but this is just impressive. The Pennsylvania Republican Party is now pushing a plan (http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/09/gop-electoral-college-plan-beat-obama-2012) wouild give Barack Obama a minority of PA's electoral votes even if he wins the state by the margin he won it by in 2008:



via (http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2011/09/new-adventures-electoral-cynicism)

edit: nevermind. I don't think that moving away from the electoral college is an obviously bad idea, but this seems like a weird way to do it. it obviously screws democrats, and creates some wacky scenarios; it's hard to imagine a lot of states democrats could win outside of northeast and california. anyway, it's not going to happen, and because of that I can't muster the requisite outrage to really care about this. electoral college vs. the popular vote is the much more interesting conversation anyway. maybe we should talk about that instead.

graz
09-15-2011, 02:44 AM
if you're going to melodramatically claim this is about "stealing elections", you're going to have to begin with a defense of the electoral college as is. the plan from current republicans in PA is pretty transparently political, but it's not obvious that moving to a system like this is necessarily bad.

It's obvious that moving to such system on a piecemeal basis is untenable. That's why the prudent movement http://www.nationalpopularvote.com/ has a method for sidestepping the temporary advantage or gaming or stealing that the Pennsylvania legislation is attempting.

Sulla the Dictator
09-15-2011, 03:11 AM
I oppose this. In theory, the electoral college can still serve as a check on the braying mob. This type of thing chips away at the utility of it.

chiwhisoxx
09-15-2011, 04:34 AM
It's obvious that moving to such system on a piecemeal basis is untenable. That's why the prudent movement http://www.nationalpopularvote.com/ has a method for sidestepping the temporary advantage or gaming or stealing that the Pennsylvania legislation is attempting.

yeah, I edited what I originally wrote, because I basically came to the same conclusion you did.