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nikkibong
04-15-2009, 04:31 PM
Just returned from Portland's Pioneer Square - right in the center of town - where I saw two, count 'em two, protesters engaged in a "teaparty" protest, shouting loudly and incoherently about taxes and spending. (Either that, or two, count 'em two, people had escaped from the nearest asylum) March on you proud revolutionaries, protecting the wealthiest among us from having to pay their fair share!!!!

Lyle
04-15-2009, 04:48 PM
I don't understand why some state governments are raising taxes in the face of a recession, however. It's not going to stimulate the economy. Sticking it to the rich can have consequences, like less investment and therefore fewer jobs.

bjkeefe
04-15-2009, 06:33 PM
Just returned from Portland's Pioneer Square - right in the center of town - where I saw two, count 'em two, protesters engaged in a "teaparty" protest, shouting loudly and incoherently about taxes and spending. (Either that, or two, count 'em two, people had escaped from the nearest asylum) March on you proud revolutionaries, protecting the wealthiest among us from having to pay their fair share!!!!

Thanks for that exciting on the scene report! You should send it in to Wonkette (http://www.wonkette.com/) or Shorts and Pants (http://www.shortsshortsshorts.com/).

bjkeefe
04-15-2009, 06:39 PM
I don't understand why some state governments are raising taxes in the face of a recession, however. It's not going to stimulate the economy. Sticking it to the rich can have consequences, like less investment and therefore fewer jobs.

Without meaning to start a debate over the worth of progressive taxation or the belief in supply-side economics, let me just remind you that many (most?) state governments are required by their own constitutions to maintain balanced budgets. I think it is beyond dispute to anyone who is not an extreme libertarian or small-government conservative that budget cuts have been going on for so long that there is virtually nothing left to be had there. The only other option, then, is to raise revenues.

I should also point out that not all proposals to raise taxes are directed at the rich. For example, in my home state, the tax on tobacco products just skyrocketed, and the governor has contemplated taxing soda and possibly other junk foods. I'm sure there are many other examples, but I don't have enough interest in reading about such matters to be able to give you more off the top of my head.

Again, I do not want to have a debate on the merits of these. I'm just pointing out a few facts, to make clear that state tax increases are being contemplated mainly for a reason other than the one you imagine -- whatever anti-stimulative effects tax increases may have are immaterial at the state level at this time. What you're seeing is merely an effort to obey the law.

graz
04-15-2009, 06:49 PM
Thirsty? Drink for thought:
http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2009/04/how_to_think_about_public_health_taxes.php

uncle ebeneezer
04-15-2009, 06:57 PM
We just raised our sales tax out here in CA. But that was obviously aimed at targeting the $ that rich people spend, rather than the $ that the rest of us also spend (and are taxed on.)

Lyle
04-15-2009, 11:21 PM
Yeah, I know... but nikkibong was talking about targeting the rich.

bjkeefe
04-15-2009, 11:26 PM
Yeah, I know... but nikkibong was talking about targeting the rich.

My response was to what you wrote.

For the record, I don't think you caught the gist of what nikkibong was saying, but I'll let you and him work that out, if either of you care.

Lyle
04-15-2009, 11:33 PM
Yes and I responded to what Nikkibong wrote, which was about sticking it to the rich. Could mean Federal taxes or State taxes, and depends on which tax targets the rich, which some do.

bjkeefe
04-15-2009, 11:43 PM
Yes and I responded to what Nikkibong wrote, which was about sticking it to the rich. Could mean Federal taxes or State taxes, and depends on which tax targets the rich, which some do.

Well, what you wrote, and what I responded (http://bloggingheads.tv/forum/showthread.php?p=110439#post110439) to, was this:

I don't understand why some state governments are raising taxes in the face of a recession, however. It's not going to stimulate the economy. Sticking it to the rich can have consequences, like less investment and therefore fewer jobs.

As I said, I don't care to debate the worth of progressive taxation or the belief in supply-side economics.

Lyle
04-15-2009, 11:48 PM
Great.