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bjkeefe
02-09-2009, 01:39 AM
Here's a thread that I propose we use to house the pushing of personal agendas, internecine squabbling, gratuitous snarking, and other forms of off-topic spleen-venting. If we get our hackles up with each other, perhaps we could head here to air them out, and in this way, keep the video pages and their corresponding threads in the diavlog forum less cluttered with things that sometimes need to come out.

If this idea works, readers sensitive to what the site owner has politely labeled "sarcasm" should probably not descend further.

bjkeefe
02-09-2009, 01:41 AM
Quite apart from the standard conspiracy theorist tactic of leaping upon a couple of anecdotes to "prove" a "trend," you know what makes kidneystones's tirade in the latest UN Plaza thread really implausible?

... A gay Canadian man, a friend for years, leveled the charge over lunch last week. He later apologized. Another friend, a French business woman, ...

Yup. The claim that he has friends.

Even a Z-list propagandist like kidneystones should know there's a limit to what the sheep will swallow.

Even more hilarious is his attempt to check as many boxes on the Big List O' Stereotypes The Stereotypical Liberal Would Like. I'm surprised he didn't make the gay Canadian HIV-positive and the French businesswoman an arugula farmer who had migrated from Cote d'Ivoire. After being adopted by the Cherokee Nation.

Pretending for a minute that kidneystones is telling the truth about his "friends" here ... (pause for derisive laughter) ... the only thing I can envision is people he has firing authority over at work whom he trapped in the company break room.

This latest post illustrates another classic kidneystones trait: his bipolarity. His screed is but a minor variant of the poison we often see from him; having apparently run out of breath for Obama hatred for the moment, he is now accusing all liberals of anti-Semitism. But it seems like just last week (hey, it was last week!) when he claimed to be worried about the fate of BH.tv, wringing his hands over comments that:

... signal to potential investors and advertisers exactly the loutish behavior tacitly approved of at bhtv.

The real comedy gold, however, lies in the threat posted at about the same time as the above "concern." Check this, from the undisputed All Time BH.tv Drama Queen:

And, actually, now that I think about it, I'm going to have to withdraw my offer to provide any financial support for the site ...

If I were the site owner, upon reading this, I would have sent him an email saying, "Fine. When your imaginary financial might has caused this site to close down, you can find someplace else (http://rattlesnakepoint.com/) for your delusional rants. And meantime, why don't you instead spend your ten dollars on a sack of rusty nails and swallow them one by one?"

==========

P.S. For the record, since kidneystones has the habit of reacting to posted criticism by later modifying his posts without so acknowledging, here is a copy of the post as I saw it when composing my response:

Challenge every Jew you meet (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/07/AR2009020701972.html?nav=hcmoduletmv). Gaza equals the Holocaust. We've seen this sort of false parallel before. Bad enough that this sort of outrageous lie obscures the enormous disparity in the economic opportunities available to Gaza and the West Bank and folks in Israel. Turns out anti-Semites within Chavez's security service (http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1062512.html) have been arrested for the attacks. Proof the system works in Venezuala, or a threat and show of imperial power by the strong-man?

Reflexive anti-Semitism is now perfectly acceptable. Liberals call defense of Israel from Hamas, Hizbollah, and Iran 'fascism. A gay Canadian man, a friend for years, leveled the charge over lunch last week. He later apologized. Another friend, a French business woman, went on about Israel using Holocaust guilt to manipulate opinion. I reminded them that Iran was arming Hamas; and that many Muslims wanted to impose the sort of restrictions on the female half of the region on property ownership that French women only recently escaped; and that Iran hangs gay people. Oh yeah.

Point is: Israel is the bad guy in the eyes of much of the world; which means that Jews worldwide can be 'challenged'.

Meanwhile, Donald Rumsfeld returns (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/08/AR2009020800695.html) in the form of Richard Holbrooke. Obama's man offered the stick to America's Nato allies this week, threatening the collape of Nato should America's allies decline to join Obama in his Necessary Afghan Adventure. Congress received a similar ultimatum this weekend issued from Give-Up Your Cash Now Or Else, while 'liberals' like Krugman, Dionne, and Ignatius purred.

Seems like old times.

bjkeefe
02-09-2009, 01:47 AM
Anticipated reply:

Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator! Thuggish moderator!

graz
02-09-2009, 02:46 AM
Your proposed solution is a capital idea. As long as kidneystones gets ample sand:
Justifying the category just got easier. Jeralyn at Talkleft has a great piece (http://www.talkleft.com/story/2009/1/31/221019/459) on Daily Kos TV and PJMTV.

Bob's begging produced an ebb in the level of invective at bhtv. One or two continue to try to make debate personal, but generally the level of abuse has diminished in the last 24 hours. That's good.

Despite protests to the contrary, BHTV is a bleeding-heart left-wing site, that tolerates, barely, dissenting views. BHTV is DKOS or TPM without the income or the numbers and that has to change.


The branding income problem takes on a new urgency. Given the stated ideological stance of TPM, Daily Kos, and PJMTV, Bob now has the opportunity to do more than talk about site diversity. There will be a site that welcomes, really welcomes, the right as much as the left. Will bhtv be that site? Hard to tell, at this stage.

Bob may indeed need to gag, at least temporarily, a few who refuse to comply with his calls for civility.

In the meantime, Bob, Greg and the rest of the bhtv need to revamp the pages to make each page more focused, appealing and PROFIT-GENERATING, with an ostentatious reach-out to the intellectual right. The dingalink may yet make the site money, but I doubt Bob will see any for a good long time. What to do in the interim?

Baltimoron wants (http://bloggingheads.tv/forum/showthread.php?p=102438#post102438) more personalized bhtv products. He's on to something. Bob is a minor cultural icon, like David Bowie. Bob has a handful of groupies desperate daily to have Bob acknowledge their existence. Perfectly understandable.

A subscribers' page with names publicly listed alphabetically will be enough to win 40 to 60 bucks out of most folks. I subscribe to half a dozen online publications, including scholarly journals, and never bothered to tally up the total cost. It's just part of the price of the life I live.

Bob needs to do far more to foster a bhtv culture, one of true intellectual diversity and respect. I've complained for years about the cruddy production values of this site and over the years Bob has grudgingly upgraded the joint. But too slowly and without any thought, it seems, towards generating revenue.

The webpage is a retail portal whereby people build an identity by clicking. A price must be exacted for every click. 'When you've got nothing, you've got nothing to lose'. One commenter (http://bloggingheads.tv/forum/showthread.php?p=102722#poststop) this weekend 'jokingly' remarked that bhtv might go broke and that this might be a good thing. WTF? Each click gets you closer to the inner sanctum that is Bob. But to cross the threshold, you got to pay.

Pay as you go. Visit and watch for free. Read, too. More on that in a bit. But if you want to BELONG to the bhtv community and be part of the inner bhtv circle you got to pony up, kids. Make it worth something. The subscriber base with income and other demographic info advertisers REQUIRE before considering placing ads is all part of the joy.

Product-plus means personalized bhtv hats, jackets, mugs, and mouse pads. Nice ones. Remember, Bob? Like that nifty baseball jacket you held up for the camera a million years ago. Which means CafePress is killing you. Folks will wait for a sixty dollar personal Golf shirt as long as it's nice and as long as it is a limited edition item.

Calender events. What do we have to look forward to at bhtv? Who the fuck knows, or seems to care? Huh? Remember the teasers, Bob? Remember working in the promise of something nice into the diavlog? You need weekly and monthly income drives and to get new subscribers.

Read much? Actually, I do! And I'll bet your money that lots of other viewers do, too. As scintillating as the tiny gaggle of commenters find their own prose, why not encourage real writers to place essays here? You know a few, I'm sure.

Comments generate hits. I get it. If you must have the commenters on this site, hide them the hell away from anyplace potential advertisers might visit. Or do something to ensure that people attack ideas, not individuals. My years at DKOS and elsewhere have given me elephant-hide, but one shouldn't need the armor of a modern tank to post a thought.

Class act? Not so much. Until BHTV feels, smells, and looks like a good literary, video, radio magazine, only a tiny minority of fans will cough-up. I'm talking now about the need for urgent, transformative change.

Class of pack? Absolutely. At its worst bhtv is currently far superior to any competing product. For now. That is sure to change.

Make bhtv an Obama free-zone, as much as possible. Forget my personal antipathy towards the fraud. There's nothing at all special about sucking up to the SMILE. And you, Bob, you, Mickey, Greg and the rest really need to remind viewers how special this site is.

You're the first and you're still the best. But that alone doesn't currently make you good enough to survive, much less thrive.

Consider this my parting post for the moment. I really do have far, far better ways to spend my time. I still watch and I'll always have a soft spot for Meaning of Life TV.

Best of luck.

P

bjkeefe
02-19-2009, 10:43 AM
Maybe it's goes against the spirit of this thread to put this here, but I couldn't think of a better place. Anyway, I thought it might be a handy reference for some of the basic economic questions that have been batted around lately. Here's Greg Mankiw's list (http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2009/02/news-flash-economists-agree.html) (via (http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/02/where-economist.html)), "together with the percentage of economists who agree:"

1. A ceiling on rents reduces the quantity and quality of housing available. (93%)
2. Tariffs and import quotas usually reduce general economic welfare. (93%)
3. Flexible and floating exchange rates offer an effective international monetary arrangement. (90%)
4. Fiscal policy (e.g., tax cut and/or government expenditure increase) has a significant stimulative impact on a less than fully employed economy. (90%)
5. The United States should not restrict employers from outsourcing work to foreign countries. (90%)
6. The United States should eliminate agricultural subsidies. (85%)
7. Local and state governments should eliminate subsidies to professional sports franchises. (85%)
8. If the federal budget is to be balanced, it should be done over the business cycle rather than yearly. (85%)
9. The gap between Social Security funds and expenditures will become unsustainably large within the next fifty years if current policies remain unchanged. (85%)
10. Cash payments increase the welfare of recipients to a greater degree than do transfers-in-kind of equal cash value. (84%)
11. A large federal budget deficit has an adverse effect on the economy. (83%)
12. A minimum wage increases unemployment among young and unskilled workers. (79%)
13. The government should restructure the welfare system along the lines of a “negative income tax.” (79%)
14. Effluent taxes and marketable pollution permits represent a better approach to pollution control than imposition of pollution ceilings. (78%)

claymisher
02-20-2009, 03:54 AM
I remember seeing that kind of thing when I was in college. I think the AEA does it every year at the convention or something.

It's pretty funny really. That's what the field has to offer: rent control is bad. Thanks guys.

bjkeefe
02-20-2009, 04:50 AM
I remember seeing that kind of thing when I was in college. I think the AEA does it every year at the convention or something.

It's pretty funny really. That's what the field has to offer: rent control is bad. Thanks guys.

Point taken, but I think there's a little more to it than that.

I should also say that to the rent control point issue specifically, it never fails to amaze me how many people still think this is a good idea. Sometimes what seems obvious to you and me nonetheless bears repeating.

claymisher
07-17-2009, 02:27 PM
Thanks for that.

A little bi-partisan healthcare polling. (http://townhall.com/columnists/MattTowery/2009/07/16/americans_are_against_the_health_care_proposal)

Come on, this has nothing to do with the diavlog at all. Cool it with the flamebait.

Whatfur
07-17-2009, 05:00 PM
Come on, this has nothing to do with the diavlog at all. Cool it with the flamebait.

Healthcare discussion was a fairy large part of this vlog...was it not? I felt this article was significant to both sides for the fact that it could show some on the left that it was ok not to like this country changing, country damaging, legislation attempting to be shoved down all of our throats and it showed those here on the right that not all on the left have been gulping the Obama grog. (admittedly the author is right-wing...but you would have to admit that 80% of the links provided in comments here are left-wing because that is about the make up of the who comments here)

Bottom line, this poll and article could have very well been brought up by Will and listed on the top right link list while. Would you have emailed Will?

Did you send a similar note to the gentleman who posted the moyers link? I don't see it. So in reality, this attempt is little more than a charade, to stifle what I may see as relevant or a little back-patting to nikkibong's insulting post to me.

As I told bong, either skip my links, (pretty easy and its not like you and yours don't produce a fair amount of BS posts yourself...with your without links) or go read it and make a discussion out of it...or read it and move on.

This will be my last trip to the Sandbox. Ummm...can I have my truck back.

pampl
07-17-2009, 05:29 PM
This will be my last trip to the Sandbox.

That's too bad. I think it's valuable having someone argue the orthodox conservative position, to put other positions in context, but sometimes it seems that what you want to argue about is only vaguely related to any active diavlogue threads. At least you don't try to turn every thread into a push for secession, I suppose.

AemJeff
07-17-2009, 06:06 PM
Healthcare discussion was a fairy large part of this vlog...was it not? I felt this article was significant to both sides for the fact that it could show some on the left that it was ok not to like this country changing, country damaging, legislation attempting to be shoved down all of our throats and it showed those here on the right that not all on the left have been gulping the Obama grog. (admittedly the author is right-wing...but you would have to admit that 80% of the links provided in comments here are left-wing because that is about the make up of the who comments here)

Bottom line, this poll and article could have very well been brought up by Will and listed on the top right link list while. Would you have emailed Will?

Did you send a similar note to the gentleman who posted the moyers link? I don't see it. So in reality, this attempt is little more than a charade, to stifle what I may see as relevant or a little back-patting to nikkibong's insulting post to me.

As I told bong, either skip my links, (pretty easy and its not like you and yours don't produce a fair amount of BS posts yourself...with your without links) or go read it and make a discussion out of it...or read it and move on.

This will be my last trip to the Sandbox. Ummm...can I have my truck back.

Why the fuck do you only post like that as you say you're getting ready to leave - no ad hominem, no gratuitous insults, and what reads like an honest, unembellished account of your opinion on something important?

Whatfur
07-17-2009, 09:36 PM
Why the fuck do you only post like that as you say you're getting ready to leave - no ad hominem, no gratuitous insults, and what reads like an honest, unembellished account of your opinion on something important?

I have to admit that I am having trouble understanding that sentence. In any case, I believe you think my comment about my last post in the SandBox meant I was going on another sabbatical. No. You are not that lucky. I just meant that I would not be utilizing this particular thread in the manner some wish it might be.

As far as "no ad hominem, no gratuitous insults". I won't bother arguing the fact that I seldom start the downward spirals...I just am always willing to follow y'all there while admitting to stepping them up a notch at times. I also admit to generalizations in original posts that I cannot control who chooses to be offended or who choose to include themselves in the category I create. I mean if I say "I am amazed that the libtards here...etc. etc. Only you can choose to become one...and I will let you.