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View Full Version : The Week in Blog: Let's Play Electoral Chess!


Bloggingheads
05-30-2008, 03:56 PM

graz
05-30-2008, 04:06 PM
I do admire Conn's visage. His comportment is beyond reproach.
His intellectual chops are if nothing else consistent.
All in all, a fair representation of a discredited movement, searching for a reason to be.
My antihero.
http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/11459?in=00:10:28&out=00:11:56

Thus Spoke Elvis
05-30-2008, 04:32 PM
I just noticed this, but if Bill grew his hair out a little, he'd be a dead ringer for a young Richard Thompson (http://youtube.com/watch?v=BGElzro9n0U).


I wonder if he's a fan? I imagine he'd agree with the sentiments of Thompson's "Dad's Gonna Kill Me" (http://youtube.com/watch?v=B_h1PeHmhe0), perhaps the best (anti-)war song of the past several years.

Whatfur
05-30-2008, 04:44 PM
I just noticed this, but if Bill grew his hair out a little, he'd be a dead ringer for a young Richard Thompson (http://youtube.com/watch?v=BGElzro9n0U).


I wonder if he's a fan? I imagine he'd agree with the sentiments of Thompson's "Dad's Gonna Kill Me" (http://youtube.com/watch?v=B_h1PeHmhe0), perhaps the best (anti-)war song of the past several years.

Oh my God... a drummer with a sweater vest...too funny.

osmium
05-30-2008, 04:50 PM
conn says (http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/11459?in=00:33:37&out=00:34:00) obama picking jim webb would reinforce his post-partisan message.

obama should do one over on john kerry and offer john mccain his VP spot. let's have a postmodern election.

PaulL
05-30-2008, 05:23 PM
Bill mentions that there is a chance of some "progressive legislating" with a new Congress/Obama presidency (http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/11459?in=00:08:55&out=00:09:10).
Do that include Gun Control/AWB renewal?

Or will Progressives/Obama campaign not talk about Gun Control during the election and after the election, start screaming that the Democrats must pass more gun control laws because that is what they campaigned on and why the American people elected them.
Its a pro-gun House, a pro-gun Senate and [Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) or Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.)] wont want to deal with it, McCarthy said (http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2008/05/progun_control.php)

gwlaw99
05-30-2008, 05:37 PM
Conn needs to stop asking Bill legal questions if Bill doesn't understand how the judicial system works. It wastes all of our time when Bill completely side steps his questions and says that the courts should order congress to pass a law.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 05:50 PM
Conn needs to stop asking Bill legal questions if Bill doesn't understand how the judicial system works. It wastes all of our time when Bill completely side steps his questions and says that the courts should order congress to pass a law.

That's a legitimate gripe, but I think it's easy to restate what Bill somewhat inartfully said. Yes, the courts cannot make Congress to pass a law, but they can make a ruling in such a way that works as a de facto recommendation (or punt back to the legislature, depending on how you want to spin a specific decision). They need only make an extremely narrow ruling on some technicality and then say something in their majority opinion about the larger issue "should be decided by the people" or something equally grandiose-sounding, which really amounts to them saying, "figure this out for yourselves." Even if the opinion does not make an explicit statement like this, a sufficiently narrow ruling on some hot button issue carries the unambiguous implication.

I'm sorry I can't think of a specific example right now, but it seems to me that one frequently hears about cases being decided in just this way.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 05:57 PM
A better effort by Bill and Conn this time around. Thanks for that. I thought the DEM VP discussion was especially good (except for Bill's fretting about the party being further divided by a blogospheric debate over the choice), as was the speculation about the progressive agenda.

The thing Conn did to make the electoral vote result in a tie was quite clever. I had to laugh at his conclusion, that the next president would be picked by Nancy Pelosi. That'd be an absolutely delicious payback for the current one having been picked by Antonin Scalia.

One gripe -- reading that blog post (from Townhall.com?) responding to Obama's commencement speech was kind of stupid. I swear, some of those wingnut blogs are just infested with people who do nothing but wait for something to be offended by, even if it's by omission. Cracks me up when conservatives try to accuse liberals of being "too PC" or whatever when there are so many hypersensitive types on their own side.

But maybe it was all just a set-up for reading P.J. O'Rourke's column. If so, heh.

Joel_Cairo
05-30-2008, 06:10 PM
Does anybody else find it really hard to follow Conn when he reads aloud? Somehow I just can't parse it.

Please slow down Conn. You read as if to quickly remind us of what it says, or to recall the text in question, but many of us haven't yet read it!

piscivorous
05-30-2008, 06:11 PM
I wonder if that sentiment, of the speech Mr Carrol read, might not ring somewhat true for say Bill Gates or Warren Buffet. The students of
the eliet Universities founded by those who pursued the advice in the commencement speech now are not encouraged to do what their founding fathers did. Ironic no. Seems that it takes a buck or two to do just about anything one wants to do. The more bucks the more likely you are to achieve your desired humanistic goal. Or you can just go around with your hat in hand begging for it from those that have it and if that doesn't work you can get the government to appropriate it from those that do at the point of a gun.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 06:19 PM
Bill mentions that there is a chance of some "progressive legislating" with a new Congress/Obama presidency (http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/11459?in=00:08:55&out=00:09:10).
Do that include Gun Control/AWB renewal?

It is to dream, isn't it?

In reality, I doubt Obama will invest much political capital in this. Gun control is not given much play on the Issues section of his site (http://www.barackobama.com/issues/) -- there is no separate entry for it, and only a few mentions, like in the "Urban Policy" section.

I think he'd like to be able to have one thing to show in this area come re-election time, so I could see him pushing for something on the edge, like some restrictions on assault weapons and/or more stringent purchase/registration requirements. Beyond that, I'd bet not. Any smart Democratic politician has to know that this issue is pretty much dead: the pro-gun side has won. To go even further, it seems clear that one of the ways that the Dems are trying to reach out to broaden their support is to be a little more pro-gun.

I suppose there could be something of a "perfect storm" scenario, in which the Dems do even better than predicted in Congress, Obama is still in his honeymoon period, and then another dreadful thing like the Va. Tech. thing happens. In this case, there might be a little more of a comprehensive law pushed through. Apart from this, though, I don't expect much to happen.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 06:25 PM
pisc:

It seems to me that you, Conn, and PJ all have this impression that Obama was asking students to be in the Peace Corps, or to pursue some other do-gooder role, from graduation through retirement. I watched the speech a few days ago, and my memory of it was that he was asking, at least by implication, for a couple of years of service. Virtually no one stays in the Peace Corps for life.

piscivorous
05-30-2008, 06:36 PM
One gripe -- reading that blog post (from Townhall.com?) responding to Obama's commencement speech was kind of stupid. Actually I was more responding to the above, kinda stupid line from your comment.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 06:39 PM
Actually I was more responding to the above, kinda stupid line from your comment.

If that was an attempt at clarification, it is not burdened by success.

Wonderment
05-30-2008, 06:46 PM
There are a lot of good ways Obama can approach gun control without threatening the 2nd Ammendment.

For one thing, he can join the rest of the international community in cracking down on the small arms trade. US opposition to the Small Arms Treaty has defied 150 nations at the UN, Oxfam, Amnesty International, HRW, a group of Nobel Prize Laureates, etc.

US suppliers and manufacturers of small arms are responsible for an estimated 35% of the global megadeath trade.

Here's where we stood under Bush:

But in the end the 2006 conference concluded with only a resolve to continue talking -another conference in January of this year, again this month and again in November, and perhaps a report to the U.N. sometime before the end of the year. There was one key player in the trade of international arms who managed to derail all talk of a binding treaty. Even the U.N. resolution, supported by more than 150 nations, that only called for more negotiation on a potential agreement was opposed by that one nation -the United States.

"We don't see any need for treaties or agreements coming out of this." -so said the U.S. Ambassador at the time, John Bolton.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 06:53 PM
Wonderment:

I'm wasn't speaking so much about what Obama could do. I was giving my prediction for what he will do.

You probably already know that in my heart, I'd like to see much more stringent gun control in this country. It's just that I think it's a lost cause, and not worth spending time or energy on at the national level, when there are so many other things to do that have better chances for success.

Wonderment
05-30-2008, 07:13 PM
I'm wasn't speaking so much about what Obama could do. I was giving my prediction for what he will do.

Well, we'll see. Gotta get him elected first (I'm hopeful).

I agree that we won't see much movement on gun control for personal use, but with a progressive Obama appointment to the UN we could see progress on small arms control internationally; with Sam Nunn as VP we could see progress toward abolition of nuclear weapons; and with a Dem. Congress and 3-4 new SC Justices (unfortunately, the libs are the oldest and most likely to retire first), we could see some good new legislation on gun safety, sales and bullet ID that's bullet-proof on constitutionality.

bjkeefe
05-30-2008, 07:22 PM
Wonderment:

... 3-4 new SC Justices (unfortunately, the libs are the oldest and most likely to retire first) ...

Yes. Which makes it all that much more important to get Obama elected, so the 80-year-olds can be replaced by 50-year-olds.

uncle ebeneezer
05-30-2008, 08:49 PM
Thus-- I genuinely hate emoticons, but i did literally "laugh out loud" at this. Thanks-- UE

Thus Spoke Elvis
05-30-2008, 10:32 PM
I'll going to have a hard time being critical of Scher's positions when I half-expect him to break out into a rendition of "Calvary Cross" at any moment.

razib
05-30-2008, 11:03 PM
let's talk about what conn said, not wut he looks like....

Whatfur
05-30-2008, 11:13 PM
my submission (http://www.movievillains.com/images/nottingham.jpg)...

jh in sd
05-30-2008, 11:34 PM
Bill, If your kitty is going to continue to grace your diavlogs, (although this time only verbally) you could at least introduce us to it.

Bill Scher
05-31-2008, 12:55 AM
Thus Spoke Elvis, I'm actually not much of a Richard Thompson fan. My folkie preferences are Loudon Wainwright III, Jonathan Richman, Phil Ochs, Christine Lavin, Sarah Harmer. Though I listen to a lot more country as of late: Avett Brothers, Robbie Fulks, Steve Earle, Ray Wylie Hubbard, Hayes Carll.

jh in sd, and anyone else who likes cats, we have two, thanks for asking! They are The Governor (the loud one) and Maru, both of whom occasionally star on bloggingheads, and both are on Catbook:

http://apps.facebook.com/catbook/profile/view/984133
http://apps.facebook.com/catbook/profile/view/984188

rgajria
05-31-2008, 01:02 AM
Senator John McCain told Governor Romney that he got into the military for patriotism not profit in one of the debates. So Conn ought to take note of that.

Wonderment
05-31-2008, 02:03 AM
Thanks for checking in, Bill, and for sharing a little of your taste in music and cats.

Even though we are a rough crowd at Bheads, I think most of us appreciate both your and Conn's dedication to discussing the issues respectfully.

harkin
05-31-2008, 09:29 AM
Leaf blowers and stray cats.........


my submission

My niece pointed out this one (http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/8037/princeofspace3uc3.jpg) to me when she observed BHsTV one day.

And Richard Thompson is great. Seen him live a few times, going back to a show with Linda at the Roxy and McCabe's with Jo-el Sonnier.

Thus Spoke Elvis
05-31-2008, 10:15 AM
I like your taste in music, Bill. Jonathan Richman has put on a few of the best concerts I've ever seen, and as you might surmise from my screen name, I've always had a soft spot for Phil Ochs (http://www.amazon.com/gp/customer-media/product-gallery/B0000011T1/ref=cm_ciu_pdp_images_0?ie=UTF8&index=0).

Given your politics, however, I will admit being a bit surprised that I didn't see Billy Bragg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Bragg) on your list of favorite folkies. :)

jh in sd
05-31-2008, 10:30 AM
Bill, Thanks for the info! I loved the way you didn't miss a beat in the last diavlog when you got a cat tail in the face.

PaulL
06-01-2008, 01:52 PM
Obama's historic race relations speech. (http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/11459?in=00:33:22&out=00:33:35)
Sorry Bill, the great historic race relations speech was a flop.
Obama has ended up rejecting both Rev Wright and resigning from Trinity United Church of Christ.

PaulL
06-01-2008, 01:57 PM
It is to dream, isn't it?

In reality, I doubt Obama will invest much political capital in this. Gun control is not given much play on the Issues section of his site (http://www.barackobama.com/issues/) -- there is no separate entry for it, and only a few mentions, like in the "Urban Policy" section.

I suspect that is because Obama does not want to anger the dreaded "gun lobby".
As a member of the board of the anti-gun Joyce foundation, I would guess Obama will push for Gun control once he is elected.

Wonderment
06-01-2008, 03:02 PM
As a member of the board of the anti-gun Joyce foundation, I would guess Obama will push for Gun control once he is elected.

Hey, Great group, Paul. Thanks for your service to peace!